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couldn't agree more. You will end in disappointment if you do not provide enough for a decent result. Most of us started with small cabinet installations. And you learn from those.. I can predict very easy the outcome. Your plants will have extremely fluffy buds. Due to no substance, they will dry very quick and so have a rather harsh taste of fresh hay when smelled and smoked. You have to cure those for a few weeks to get a smooth smoke.. potency will be very much on the low, so do not expect a coucher, even you do a late harvest. It needs energy to form substance. Light is beside water a key factor, not enough is just not enough. Only way i see your setup work is with a Autoflower.. she will do her thing as much as you starve her on energy (run those lamps 24/7, no need for a timer). I still would invest the Eskom bill into a bag of weed from the corner. You need a lot more light...

I totally understand where you are coming from, but you are setting yourself up for disappointment. 1. Bag seeds. Its random and has an extremely high chance of being a hermi. So trying to save R100 on a seed purchase, to spend all that money on electricity for at least 2 months before you realize this, will cost more. 2. I mentioned the minimums with regard to light as its crucial. You are trying to emulate the Sun indoors. Plants have minimum requirements to grow, and giving them any less is again a waste of electricity, and the plants will fail to thrive and die or hermi. We all have to start somewhere, and it's a bit expensive to startup, but skimping now will honestly just be an expensive disappointment. I started out with just a small veg area, and utilized the sun as much as I could. I still do this. I have plants veg indoors, and flower them outdoors this time of year. You can do this in summer to if you are keen on a non negotiable routine of carrying them indoors and out daily at exactly the same time. That way you just need a ventilated darkroom as a start...just a few suggestions, as there are many ways to skin a cat.

Yeah if you want to attempt to use lumens as measurement, aim for minimum 30k-50k lumens for veg, 60k-120k for flower. The sun as lumens is about 1k on an overcast day, 20k in the shade on a sunny day, and max about 120k lumens in midday summer sun. Again not much is useful as it's not PAR we're talking about, but to give you an idea just how much more lumens you need.

Greetings 420 Fam. I've decided to put this thread together for the newbies to the indoor growing scene and anyone else that it may help. Anyway, it's for everyone to have a look at and hopefully it will give them a little bit of guidance when it comes to choosing the method of training that they want to use on their cannabis tree. Honestly, I wish someone broke it down for me when I started as it would've saved me a few months of experimenting by myself and accidentally coming across new methods somewhere random to try out. Anyway, here goes; Okay, so there's a lot to consider when you're aiming to increase your yield while not outgrowing the space you have available... Let's start with the simple stuff. My suggestion would be to research a bit on what you read here first before committing fully. Here's what you need to consider; - Acquiring good genetics (high yielding plant). Your bagseed flowers may look awesome, but most of the time it's genetics are a big twisted mess and stable genetics will yield you more bud per/m2. - Setting up a hydroponic system will get you a faster growth rate, but not necessarily a higher yield (although the time taken to get it would be shorter by a week or 2). - If you're using soil, you need a well mixed grow medium with enough drainage to ensure proper oxygen concentration in the root zone. - Use a good nutrient line if you aren't using living soil (it doesn't have to be expensive, it just has to work well). - Make sure your space isn't too big for your light (you may end up with airy, smaller buds or just a really slow growth rate if you ignore your limits here). - Ensure your plants get enough direct airflow to develop healthy, strong stems and so they receive ample fresh air. If you've considered of all of that, then you don't have much else to decide. LST works well, but it takes a lot of patience and when using it even with FIMing, but it isn't the most effective. This is because you still have to, in a way, let the plant grow normally and constantly train it to fit your space FIMing your tree will just give you more branches to train. The next 2 methods I'm going to mention are ways of making the plant grow into your space and it sort of has a predefined shape, which requires minimal training and even less once you decide to flower. Mainlining a tree requires less patience, and a bit of confidence when using this method because you will have to use some heavy HST with LST. I've used a slight variation of this on my last grow. I came out with about 204g of top shelf bud off a single tree (in a 70cm x 70cm tent). "Quadlining" has been coming up more recently and I've done this on a Microgrow I had running a while ago. You don't remove as much plant material as the previous method but the results are pretty similar. It requires slightly less time than Mainlining but also works well on maximizing yield... I was able to get 40g from 1sq ft off a single, small tree. Both these methods were effective at creating an even canopy with minimal LST and without the need of a net/trellis, but they do involve HST which means you will have recovery periods that add to your total length of the grow. I haven't tried any other methods, but from my understanding; ScrOG is one of the most effective at getting a maximum yield as this is a more controlled way of creating an even canopy and involves using a rigid screen through which you weave the tree as it grows. This makes maximum use of your space as you can decide what size grid to use and when you think its packed enough to flower. This method comes at the cost of a long veg time and regular maintenance, due to having to check which tops are growing pass the others and getting others in optimal positions. I'm not sure what other yield boosting techniques are commonly used but IMO; I think you're better off running your trees with the mainlining technique. Do some searching on Google to see how each of the methods work and see which one you'd feel comfortable doing. Everyone has their own preference I know this isn't a complete, thorough guide or like a how-to, but I hope it helps some of you. Feel free to also share the link with anyone that has a yield boosting question that can be answered by this post. If you're gonna add information to this thread, all I ask is that you please be sure of the methods you're posting. I've tried different methods and I've compiled this from my own experience. Peace [emoji1308] Happy Growing Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

@CreX Forgot to reply, wanted to thank you it has helped a lot! Plants are looking great!

After a very successful outdoor DWC grow last season, i'm going to copy my setup, take it indoors, and run them under a High Spec Samsung LED Quantum Bar setup. I wanted to steer away from using grow tents, and i'm fortunate enough to have some extra room in the garage. So decided to build my very own Grow Room. The garage is exactly 3 meters wide and the ceiling in 2,4 meters high. After weighing up many many options, I designed the following. A simple wood frame made from 22mm x 44mm pine planks and then skin the frame with Masonite Hardwood sheets https://www.boardmaster.co.za/pc-prime-coat-masonite.html End result came out fantastic and the Masonite boards are so easy to work with, the are probably a third of the weight of Rhino Board, and it comes with a white side as standard. So even bigger bonus. End result..... Simple, straight forward, and very easy to build with only a handful of tools. The floor space inside the room is exactly 3,0m x 1,3m I will just be growing on one half of the room, whilst the other half is work area and clones. The light fixture is a 320W Quantum Board 3-bar design from https://www.onlinegrowshop.co.za/ and its powered by a Meanwell HLG driver. The main reason i decided to go for a Quantum Bar instead of a Quantum board is the more uniform coverage the the Quantum Bars offer. Dimensions of the light: The bars are 1100mm long And the frame is 900mm wide Makes for a perfect fit for my grow area. As mentioned above im going to be doing DWC in individual 25L plastic buckets with and central air pump providing continuous oxygen to each bucket. I will be growing 5x Blue Kush seeds from Dynafem and also managed to score a free Cresendo cutting from a friend. Seedling are 2 weeks old and looking very happy in their "Jacuzzis"

Greetings again... Things are going smoothly in the tent. I'm rearranging everything in and around the space, trying to create a better flow in the grow area so everything looks a bit better and is easier to work around. I had to apply some serious bondage to this tree a day ago as the colas were just flopping all over the place already, barely holding up their own weight. Watering will be a bit more difficult now but it can be done. These flowers have some major frost on them, these pictures just don't do it justice... Anyway, enjoy

@afternoon blazer yo dude! dont get disheartened! these guys have all been where you are and are just honesty trying to give you a realistic view of what will happen. @Totemic raised a very important note about being religious with taking the plant inside everyday and outside everyday - at the same time everyday - for the remainder of the plants life. if you give them as much sun as possible during the day and an area that does not get disturbed by light AT ALL EVER at night you should end up with something that will be a bit better than your average corner shwagg and do yourself a flavour - buy even just one seed of a particular cultivar - even the cheaper seeds are better than bagseed. i would keep your seeds going none the less, give them all the sun you can possibly give them. and then into darkness at night. the days are pretty short currently which is fine for flowering. i would even consider not running a veg period. what this means for you is a shorter day period and a longer night cycle. probably close to 10:14 . if i were you, i would take your plants inside at night and keep them pitch black from tonight even. the plants will be smaller, but will still be decent enough to be proud of.

awesome news man! glad i could help

What’s up my fellow growers. So here’s an update on my grow! The girls are looking good and are happy so far, had a hiccup but it’s been resolved atleast, I think my medium was a bit hot for the little girls but they seem Gucci now!

Little bit of winter sifting to check out what my new seeds are like. This plant is fire. Will drop some pollen i got frozen on her, same daddy, so will be a BX to the dads line.

@Batista yes so the actual grow space directly underneath the light is 1,5 x 1,3 I think the light could cover a slightly larger area, but this is a good start i think, The full white walls + floor will help alot. The 320w 3-bar light is R9000 yes, includes everything. Insanely good quality tho! As most things in life, you get what you pay for. This is a top top quality LED grow light. The efficiency of the system is unreal! Will post more stats and specs soon.

He is using a free app on his phone - decent enough to give a basic idea about the light intensity. 5000lux is quite a bit on the low end though... It will keep the plants in veg... But won't be enough for decent veg or average veg. So the basic guide from the phone tells him that his lights are too weak, regardless of par. Not everyone can afford an apogee ay

I can't prove it with any chemical analysis but I wouldn't trust their gas as being impurity free. Newport claims to be almost impurity free so even their butane isn't 100% impurity free but it's the best on our local market for the purpose. If you're not using a vacuum chamber then you're putting yourself at even more risk. All those impurities have a decent chance of ending up in your lungs unfortunately. From face value Alva is a low end, relatively cheap butane available in SA, I wouldn't trust it personally. Don't panic though, who knows it may be good enough, but for peace of mind I would just stick with Newport from now on. At least they claim its almost impurity free. The other butane suppliers in this country don't.

No problem bro. I'll attach some pics of the veg and here's a link to my flux/mainline grow journal; https://forum.grasscity.com/threads/harvested-nirvana-blue-dream-indoor-grow-nebulas-manifold.1548198/ The final topping was done (2nd September), I tied her down again 10 days later (12th), and I flipped to 12/12 lighting 6 days after that (18th).

Wait until the pots are light light again. You can dig your finger into the meduim a bit when you think it's a bit dry to feel if the coco is in fact dry... But I like a feel weight test... Lift the pot up... If it's light... Give a tiny bit of water... The plants haven't even sprouted yet so they need practically zero water... One cup a week should be more than enough at this stage. They will grow well in the full sun. As soon as they break the surface I would remove those humidity domes and let them get full sun.

Can I enter a vegging plant?

I'd never let air sit, rather keep the flow going in my opinion. If your room has passive air vents, or you could make them, then run one extraction fan only, and let the room suck in air, then you wouldn't need them both going. Also my opinion and what I'm currently doing myself. You'll easy tell if your temps get to high or you cant get the humidity right, then you can add the second fan, pulling or pushing air, if needed.

@TheUltimateNoob duuuude Great grow diary man. I will be sure to use it as a guide when going through the grow cycle on my side. Your training was done exceptionally well. I think I saw you mention Seagro. I am an avid fan of Seagro as a base nutrient during veg. Did you use throughout the cycle? And another quick question. I did a test of our tap water and it averages a PH in the low 7 range. Seagro is an acidic solution so can one assume that by mixing it with the tap water the PH would come down to the 6 range? Reason for the question is the fact that I use the manual PH testing kit and I struggle to see the colour reactions. Especially when testing after adding Seagro due to its dark colour.

Fair point! If you look at it.. when I started growing, my first light nearly ruined me financially .. and compared to what we get now, starting to grow indoors was never cheaper.

I don't think a single QB288 even needs a heatsink on its own. You could just even use a flat piece of aluminium if you really really wanted to mount it onto something, or install a little pc fan on the back.

Morning all. So its day 3 since potting. No sprouts yet. Quick question. Should i be leaving the seedlings in darkness until they pop up?? Thanks for the advise @Totemic @Prom The seeds have already poped a taproot and then i potted them in the containers above. With regards to the lights. I totally understand where u guys are coming from with correct lumens and PAR instead. And the different intensities for different stages. However. Would really appreciate some advise on how to make a grow work with the shitty stuff i have currently. As mentioned before. Right now i am soley interested in getting a grow completed. Regardless of yield being low with the stuff i have. Once i feel confident enough with a shit grow to know WTF i am doing. I domt mind spending a few bucks on the proper shit. I do know i have crap to work with currently. But if can get a grow going with crap. I feel i would be ready to grow some proper good shit. It is abit difficult to keep temps where it needs to be now since its winter. But i will try. And yeah the lux meter was just something of play store to get an idea if i atleast have a basic minimun light to get a grow going. Also. I did use bag seeds for now. To make sure i dont waste my hard earned Madibas. Cheap experiments before the expensive under taking

Agreed, it definitely is the wrong unit to measure in... But it is still a great indicator as to how intense your lighting is... One thing par and lumens have in common is the further away from the light source you go, the lower your reading becomes. And I really doubt you will be hitting high par, with a low comparison lux reading. Just saying it's an indicator

I agree, is expensive.. I just want to point out, Lumens is the wrong unit to look at in regards to plants.

Sorry bro, you can trash that meter if you got it for plants.. Lumens and LUX are measuring units for our (humans) visible spectrum range. Plant see different.. a lot different. You use a PAR meter. It measures the photosynthetically available radiation (PAR). What the plant can actually use. If you want to read up more detailed, check this article: https://growguru.co.za/blogs/hydroponic/plant-lighting-demystifying-lumens-lux-and-par And when you look for LED lights, look to be in the 3000k range and have some 660nm infra red inside.. plants love it for flowering

Yes that's correct, I was made to understand that topping was the wanted outcome, and when people had done it, but not close enough to the base, then you get the FIM, as it says itself, fuck I missed. Or they named it wrong. I do know guys who go for FIMing, but it was originated from a bad topping.

It's been a while... Got an update this afternoon, been rearranging my grow space a bit so I haven't been getting the time to make an update for you guys yet Watch this space. Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

@TheUltimateNoob Thanx for the feedback man. I would like to see some pics of your mainline topping timelapse. That'll help guide me with the tie down positioning to ensure sufficient space between colas. I'm with you on the different folks different strokes philosophy when it comes to the ladies. Kind of like different strain different train in my case. It all boils down to what the ladies tell you at the end of the day. What was your total veg period after the final 3rd topping and tie down prior to flipping? I just want to ensure enough vegetative growth to sustain solid flowering. Thanx for the guidance.

Tomato Grower here... Thanks for the great site...

@oldsandals what a trip man!! really really digged going through this thread. Some of those sativas are so bare all the calyx are separated!!! Truely amazing how far the cannabis plant has come where you can find a wonderful indica looking plant thats totally sativa in high. thanks for this man! Subbed!

Put them out at 9 today. No domes. Roughly 19 degrees now. Warming up

Hey. Thanks I will download that and check it out. Seeds come built in with about 2 weeks of nutrients stored in their first leaves called cotyledons, so they will grow regardless. But using some seagro which is an acidic fish emulsion will work fine to add the nutrients that are missing from your mix. Always start with 30% of the label dosage and work your way up to stronger doses as you see the plants coping. Quite often these labels ask you to use way too strong of dilution.

That's s very cool light meter! I'm not sure which root starter you added but coco/perlite/bonemeal will not be enough basic nutrients for the plant to grow healthy. You can use that mix you made but I would add either compost which you can find anywhere, or worm castings which is better but harder to find. You want to have about 70% your mix to 30% compost/worm castings. You also should add some dolomite lime to it for cal mag, this is also easy to find. Then you will have a decent mix and will have some success. The biggest mistake new growers make is to have a heavy growing medium that doesn't drain well and then over watering the plants. With your medium drainage will be fine. Water every 3-4 days. For when the plants are growing without making buds this is called the vegetative stage. During this time they need 18-24 hours of light per day to stay in this phase. When the plant is big enough you can switch the amount of dark and light to 12/12 and it will trigger the plant to flowering mode and it will start to make buds. Fast plants will take about 8 weeks flowering to finish. Slower plants usually up to 14 weeks unless you got landrace genetics then it can go indefinitely long some times. Another way to do it would be with plain coco and bottle nutrients specialized for coco grows. As you learn you will find your way. Good luck!

Sup bro [emoji1308] And thank you [emoji1374] I hope more people come across it so it can be shared, it will definitely help some noobs. I agree, cannabis training is very subjective and you have to choose one that best fits your grow space and schedule. I went with an 8 Cola mainline as well my last grow and I'm planning to switch back to it after I harvest my current grow. It creates the most uniform tree and a really nice, even canopy. I recently ran 2 strains in my tent this grow and treated them exactly the same, yet I still had 1 tree hermie on me... It's worth noting that the hermie didn't respond as well to the HST than the other tree, so my suggestion would be to adapt your training to your plant. If they haven't bounced back yet, give them some time before you butcher them again [emoji23]. Not every strain will react the same to stress and its pretty easy to fuck one tree up without damaging the rest. It's better to have a slightly uneven canopy rather than missing out on harvesting one entire plant due to stressing out too much with the HST. With my Blue Dream, I went for a Flux/Mainline with 8 colas and she tuned out gorgeous. Veg was complete in 6 weeks and after the 8-9 week flower, the tree netted me 204g. The method saved me about a week of veg vs regular mainlining. I can send you a link or some pics if you're interested. I know it's a bit disappointing not being able to create the canopy that you aimed for and train the plants according to schedule, but I feel that you will risk losing a couple of your trees if you disregard how they're responding to the HST and continue anyway. Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

Hi bro. I think you have a great thread going here. There is a lot of subjectivity when it comes to training methods and an overload of info on the Web. The holy grail being.. max yield, max potency. I eventually decided to go for an 8 cola mainline method on my 1st indoor grow. This after trying out various other LST and HST methods outdoors. I am currently running some different strains in my grow tent and some are taking more fondly to the top and tie down than the others. The washing machine strain from Ripper seeds is an epic pheno with insane growth. She loves the HST and recovers like a beast. Problem I have is that the other 4 strains arent necessarily taking to the HST like a champ. I am stressing that I will lose the advantage of an even canopy. Would you suggest tweaking the topping count per plant as they take to the training and recovery? Or adapt the training completely to include other LST/HST variants? Or should I perservere and just systematically top and train when they are ready without stressing too much on the difference in growth before I flip to flower? These ladies are currently almost 5 weeks old. First top and tie down on 3 of the ladies were over the past 2 days. 2 ladies still to show sufficient growth tip to tie down. Awe. *The lady in the black pot was a late entrant in the tent. She will not be part of the 8 cola mainline exercise.

The rule of every few days is marginally flawed. It works to a point and as a very rough guide. A more accurate approach would be to do the pickup test... You are running coco so it's real easy... The coco pots will literally be light as fuck... Almost no weight at all... That's when you know you need to water them. When the plants are small like that... One cup of water is enough for a very long time, what size pots are those? And take the twisty tie off not sure why it's there... Be careful not to damage the fragile stem when taking it off. If it's LST, the plant has to have a few nodes before it will be effective... What you are doing is just making the stem skew because you have tied the plant at the bottom. Lst's purpose is to bring the top of the plant lower... Exposing lower growth shoots to more direct light.

Due for a small update. Sadly none of my GTH seeds sprouted, but I'm hoping for a female clone from the source to include in this winter's run. 11 May Well over 200 of my F4 beans sprouted on a farm neither here nor there. Haven't been to visit since, but going through this week. So excited to just get out there and away from the suburbs. I want to go and remove all the males and do some other thinning. All these little ones have since been planted in the ground and well on their way. Will update on the visit. Then I have 2 of my F4 girls here, chosen from 20. I finally have a female with morphed phyllotaxy. There have been hundreds but never a female. These two, are destined to be treated with STS and will be my Choco pollen donors that are pollinating clones taken from the farm. These are in soil I got from @SkunkPharm, and they are loving it. Thanks for helping a brother out when lockdown was at high tide. I haven't fed once, and these were transplanted to 15l pots from 5l this morning in the same soil, so giving it a proper test.

Papua New Guinea

Oh wow,did you receive your Cannabist order?

Greetings Fam. There isn't much happening in the tent but the buds have started to pack on some weight. I fed them a day or 2 ago and rigged together a magnetic stirrer to put into the new CO2 generator bottle, I hooked it up to the light timer. This way it increases CO2 production during the light cycle by lightly stirring the solution and stops once the lights go out. As a separate project, I made a wing reflector out of a can and mounted 2 HID LED car headlights on it. I have it in a Microgrow box that I'll reveal to you guys in a separate thread. The entire system is 12V and runs off a PC power supply. Anyway, here are some pictures of what the Inzane tree looks like right now. The Frost is real, lol

A gift from @Cannabist A 5 pack of Harlequin Fast Fem 5:2 CBD Super fresh viable seeds, breaking the surface overnight. And off they go... Transplant time Into solo cups they go... Now it's time to start feeding a little so they continue with this early momentum.

@Batista Nice strains. Hope they reward you with some ...

Amazingly healthy roots you got yourself there! Im still trying to find stable genetics for my garden, did randoms in 2018,but in 2019 I have some Ethos Sweet Insanity ,F skittles and Wedding Cake going atm, so keen to see how they stack compared, and which I can keep going and which needs to go.

Good to see more of these comps coming out. The more the merrier! Happy to be corrected but isn't a true cannabis cup a competition where a breeder submits new strains/cultivars they've been working on for judging? I've noticed a few entities running "Cannabis Cups" in SA and none have stuck true to how they run it overseas. Has a proper cannabis cup been run in SA yet? I thinks it's time for us to get a proper cannabis cup going in SA where we find out who is breeding the best strains in the country. I reckon it will do wonders for developing the breeding industry in SA. They'll get exposure, validation of their genetics etc. Can't think of a better situation where we are relying on local breeders and not so much on the breeders from the US and Europe.

A few more mom resets...

Amnesia Mom reset... It has been many generations and she's stills an amazing plant... Indoor and Outdoor... Anyone would be able to successfully grow her. Ticks alot of the boxes. Great structure, unmistakable stem rub through all cycles so much so that she doesn't really need to be labeled, not a fussy feeder, early finisher by day 54 is when she's perfect for chop down , big yielder, top bag appeal, smells and tastes like pink grapefruit. Decent high 1-2 hours. Her cons... She foxtails easily... Too much light, during flush and any other unnecessary stresses. Kak to trim. Can be a bit of a mildew magnet...

@420sake

Sup Guys, how's the planing going for the next indoor growoff? Anything planned for the near future? I also support a buy-in idea with participants paying a fee to enter the competition and to be able to get the seeds for the comp. I personally found the forum thanks to the growoff poster that I saw on Facebook. Maybe we could do a competition between members on the forum more like a "forum only" growoff with the more experienced growers. Then we can do an open growoff for amateurs with some advertisement before hand to draw some more people to the forum if we want to grow the forum? But I guess then we still have the issue of them not posting or keeping their dairies updated. Maybe a minimum like R100 to enter the amateur competition with prices going to the best dairies with forum members voting. Let's say the top 5 dairies get 50% off to enter the next "forum only growoff" and completed dairies have the option to join the "forum only growoff". I don't think I saw any Solo cup challenge on the forum, maybe a solo cup growoff can be fun.

So my new space is slowly developing and I have decided to pop some Aurora Kush seeds. I popped 8 into jiffies and 8 popped out