Genetics

[Za Weed Lover]

Good day Growmies 

So I have a question for the guys that have been at this, way before 2018. The real OG,s and guys that just know more then me. 

So I want to know, in your opinion.  Who are the best breeders and which are the dankest strains you've grow. 

I am not looking for your everyday and especially not the main stream things. 

Why I ask, because as everyone know, I am still to see a havest . So I am not rushing and taking my time in selecting strains and growing them out to select the best pheno types.  

I am looking at starting a mother collection.  

I would appreciate as much information and if you have links, pop them in. 

Happy new to everyone and all the best for the new year. 

[Chris Jay]

My best local breeder is Jay from Amadeadly Seeds. His genetics are worth collecting, he has a facebook page only. Easy to find, also I think he has amalgamated with another bank. I am sure they are great, he does not pussy foot around.

International commercial breeder I would suggest the following seeds:

Sannies Seeds - https://www.sanniesshop.com
Reeferman ( be careful lots of fakes ) - currently only sold in Canada, but will be sold worldwide soon.
Sensi Seeds - buy through seedsman or direct from their site. Not to sure if they ship to SA.

Good luck and lets keep this list going.



 

[Chris Jay]

Sorry forgot to mention www.growlikejoe.com, he is not the breeder but works with some great old school genetics. Worth their weight in gold.

My best strains I have grown:

Nigerian 99 and Senegalese Haze from old afropips ( no longer, but growlikejoe still has genetics )
Malawi Kush -  from growlikejoe, ( my plant in the pic )
Pure Kush -  GHS
Pink Kush from Reeferman
Sour Gelato from Greensmokeroom
..... and the list can go on.

[trichomechaser]

The problem is a lot of people don't seem to know what makes a good breeder. They think that throwing together good looking cuts and doing some S1 is what makes a good breeder, "Looks fire so it must be a great breeder" on the other side there is the "Oh, this guy is running classic heirlooms, he must know what he is doing". The real good old school breeders are actually typically the guys in the US who were trading cuts in the underground long before any of the dispensaries started showing up. 

There are a lot of good podcasts out now by highly respected breeders, and just listening to them discuss the source of their cuts will get you in tune with who is really doing good work out there - and give some insight into the breeders which are publicly praised but were shady fucks in the industry who screwed over other breeders. People see hype more than they do anything else. There's also unfortunately a lot of people still stuck in the 90s, thinking that breeders who were putting out hype strains back then must still be doing good in the game. And because South Africa was quite limited in its exposure to the US underground breeding scene, not a lot of growers here are actually aware of the 'real OGs'. 

The problem here is that we see European genetics as superior, thanks mostly to the fact that they were the ones who controlled the foreign genetics market here for decades.

Look at SkunkVa from Lucky Dog Seeds, that dude was part of the group of travelling 'dead heads' who basically just followed The Grateful Dead around America, and in that community you had some of the best growers of that time sharing cuts between each other, and creating fucking legendary strains. SkunkVA is known for his Chem '91 cut ( worth listening to how it came to be: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zizcd3O92ps ) - but there is very little interest locally in these guys who originated classic cuts.

If you're looking for quality breeders that have a good balance of old school but without being stuck in the past look at:
- Riot Seeds
- Archive
- Lucky Dog (he almost exclusively works with his Chem cut though, so not much variety)
- Bodhi
- Duke Diamond
etc

There's a lot of other guys doing really good work and still actually breeding with males and females and not just seed making (silvering fems), but the above are some of the more respected guys who typically have the best connections to original cuts. With the Chem '91 mentioned above, SkunkVA himself has said majority of people claiming to be working with the cut don't actually have it (and its his cut). So one can't simply just look at a lineage or cut and take it at face value. To find the best breeders, listen to the originators of legendary cuts and see who they vouch for. You'd be surprised by how small the list really is.

Granted my list is a little US leaning, but that's honestly where I see most of the quality coming from - and it makes sense given that the new legal infrastructure there offers such a good platform for breeding development

Locally, I do like the work that Jay does. He has an interest in heirlooms, but isn't afraid to throw in some killer genetics from more 'hyped' breeders like OG Rascals (a personal favourite if you're into OG lines). 

As for which strains I've grown that I liked the most...

My favourite strains haven't typically come from the "best breeders" and in some cases were even from dudes whose breeding practices are hated by 'real breeders' - Colin from Ethos has what is considered some terrible breeding methods, but the flower (assuming it doesn't herm) can still be really satisfying to grow if you're doing it for bag appeal or flavour.

It's been difficult to get high quality breeders genetics here, so most of the strains I'm looking forward to running have only just made their way into my collection, but I'm definitely looking forward to my: Archive, Dungeon's Vault, Cannarado, Swamp Boys, Thug Pug

Just give this a watch before you buy more Dutch genetics (addresses both Reeferman and Sensi mentioned by Chris above):
 

 

Edited January 30, 2020 by trichomechaser

[1000Hills Nursery]

@Za Weed Lover 

I'm in agreement with you... 

What defines a quality breeder to me is when you fork out $60 for a 6 pack of regulars and when you pop them you find phenos that it was bred for in just 6 seeds. You will also find that these seeds were bred in a sealed chamber with a limited amount produced. 

Empire breeding company is rocking the FIRE right now in the states. 

 

[Ill_Evan]

This is a fire topic. Subbed 

[1000Hills Nursery]

What else defines a quality breeder, if we disregard all the hearsay from the forums etc, the fancy packaging and just look at breeding practices.

A simple example

Barneys Farm, they produce all their seeds outdoor in bulk. You can get their genetics from alot of different seed banks worldwide. +-150 a feminised seed.

VS

Medigrower(MG1 seed co.), he produces all his seeds in a sealed 4 x 4 flood and drain breeding chamber. Empire breeding company have just restocked his Primal Punch F2.  +-150 a regular seed. You cannot buy these seeds anywhere else in the world.

 

Edited January 30, 2020 by Mambawana

[PsyCLown]

What makes a good breeder, I'd say good breeding practices... although one wants quality genetics too.

 

Having the best breeding practices, but not having anything exceptional isn't really ideal.

You don't necessarily need to have good breeding practices to end up with some quality genetics though.

 

I agree that there are plenty of companies out there who just pollen chuck and hope for the best. They advertise one thing and in a pack of seeds you do not find that specific pheno or there are too many phenos which are undesirable.

 

Like @trichomechaser I too prefer the US breeders over the Dutch / European ones.

I too am keen to hear about some awesome breeders which are out there, in SA I feel the exposure to quality breeders is very limited unfortunately.

[CreX]

Indoor breeding facilities should be the only kind of facilities.. 

Outdoor breeding sounds alot like pollen chucking with extra steps. 

It can take years to find the right parents to breed with... Thousands of seeds. 

Careful back crossing... Pain staking culling and taking cuttings of hopefuls. 

Genetics preservation after a successful run is another ball game. 

 

[Dank]

Looooooads of growing and testing, and then more loaaads of growing and testing

As a hobby breeder i would say that a lot of dedication,  love for the plant, hard work and ultimately the time (years) put in to the selection process.

Good genetics wont save a bad grower nd bad genetics sure as hell dont help a good grower, but when its all cured and in the jar, homegrown with love, its usually clear what is dank.

Some good genes in the EU and in the States I would say, but like you guys mentioned, not all seedcompanies have fire, hell some dont even have germination 

 

[Growfo]

I would agree with most of what has been said, a good breeder should look at the bigger picture, not just breed for looks but also disease resistance, vigour, not bottleneck genes entirely and put a healthy genetics representation onto the market place that offers some stability of the intended genes he or she wanted to develop.

I wouldn't include Matt Riot of riot seeds in that personally, as i don't consider what he does seed breeding, but that might just be me, and i always questions those who appoint themselves as genetic authorities rather than earn that spot.

There are so many amazing breeders out there currently, look for those who seem to pass off the image and message that you would like to portray, look for realistic pricing, and well develop seed lines with a high occurrence of high quality offspring. If you are looking for a certain gene do you homework and see who has the closest to the source, if looking for Triangle Kush or the white then swamp boys, if looking for a wide array of elite clone hybrids then Archive or CSI humboldt

These include for me, amongst many others

Bodhi seeds

Archive

Bloom Seed co

CSI humboldt

Relentless genetics

Symbiotic

Thugpug

Swamp boys

Eskobar seeds

Karma genetics 

and many many more, but be careful, its a seed business and some people just want you hard earned cash

[Za Weed Lover]

Geez, firstly my head is trying to process the information.  But thank you to all that have shared their knowledge.  Think this thread will help more then just me. 

 

So some of the breeders that have been mentioned, I dont even know of. My other question would be, where does one source these things or does one have to order directly from the breeders, themselves? With shipping costs, it can quickly become expensive. 

[SkunkPharm]

My favourite strains to grow is Green Crack from Humboldt Seed Organisation. And Amnesia Haze from Nirvana seeds. I would like to grow Blueberry Muffin and Pineapple upside down cake from Humboldt Seed Co. On a next run.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[oldsandals]

The question should not be who are good breeders, but what environment do you have for growing and what genetics would best fit that environment AND suit your palate for quality of high effect and other requirements. Breeding is often a trade off. If you are growing outdoors its likely that you will not be able to run most indoor varieties because of powdery mildew, bud rot or some other problem like pests. If you have a perfectly controlled indoor environment then by all means go and buy from some good breeders to suit your tastes. Don't stagnate with buying one breeders stuff - you want to explore and educate yourself. 

Personally I don't run many modern hype weed. Very occasionally I will run something that is currently available to buy. But I'm a sativa lover and I don't like indica to get mixed in too often. Most of my seed stash I made myself or was gifted by friends. There are some breeder packs in there from places like Doc D, Cannabiogen, Ace Seeds but I'm not really growing those anymore. Last bunch of seeds I popped was all different landraces crossed to a Tom hill original haze male. Tried Senegal, Zambian copper, Malawi Gold, Mulanje Malawi, Punto Rojo, Ko Chang Thai, Hmong hill tribe Thai, Durban poison 70s, Zamal, golden tiger, flying dutchmen original haze. 

Just got to make friends with the right people and search the right stuff that you like and it will come eventually

 

Golden Tiger x Tom Hills Original Haze

 

Edited April 11, 2020 by oldsandals

[SkunkPharm]

7 hours ago, oldsandals said:

The question should not be who are good breeders, but what environment do you have for growing and what genetics would best fit that environment AND suit your palate for quality of high effect and other requirements. Breeding is often a trade off. If you are growing outdoors its likely that you will not be able to run most indoor varieties because of powdery mildew, bud rot or some other problem like pests. If you have a perfectly controlled indoor environment then by all means go and buy from some good breeders to suit your tastes. Don't stagnate with buying one breeders stuff - you want to explore and educate yourself. 

Personally I don't run many modern hype weed. Very occasionally I will run something that is currently available to buy. But I'm a sativa lover and I don't like indica to get mixed in too often. Most of my seed stash I made myself or was gifted by friends. There are some breeder packs in there from places like Doc D, Cannabiogen, Ace Seeds but I'm not really growing those anymore. Last bunch of seeds I popped was all different landraces crossed to a Tom hill original haze male. Tried Senegal, Zambian copper, Malawi Gold, Mulanje Malawi, Punto Rojo, Ko Chang Thai, Hmong hill tribe Thai, Durban poison 70s, Zamal, golden tiger, flying dutchmen original haze. 

Just got to make friends with the right people and search the right stuff that you like and it will come eventually

 

Golden Tiger x Tom Hills Original Haze

 

Could not aggree more.