FF Premium Problems

[Noobiegrow]

Hi guys, 

I've been growing in FF Premium classic for a while now and I can't help but notice a pattern in deficiencies across various plants snd strains. 

I've been using the soil in conjunction with the Biobizz range, and I've been trying to utilize the ammended organic nutrients fortified within the soil before applying the bottled nutes. 

I have been watering with a ph of 6-6.3, as Biobizz recommends a range of 6.2-6.3.

This is where my problems begin and I would greatly appreciate any feedback or advice....... 

My plants have started showing discolouration across the leaves, a yellowing of the leaf edges accompanied by a reduction in the intensity of the green coloring too. 

I did a runoff watering today and discovered that the soil ph was at 7.1, which based on my rudimentary research leads me to believe that it is out of 'range' for organic growing. 

After a bit more reading I discovered that FF recommends a watering ph of 5.5-6.0. Would this not be too low to stimulate microbial life? Also, why is the medium ph so high if my fertigation is at a far lower ph? 

I will attach pics below of the deficiencies, but I would greatly appreciate any input from fellow members who have experience with this soil and the correct ph required to unlock its full potential. 

Thanks

[SkunkPharm]

I am growing one plant in ff soil. I have no problems. I dont pH my water at all. What I have learnt over the years is to inoculate your soil with a good microbial blend. You could make your own and there is lots of great products out there. Products like explode grow, EM1 or Biodyne. Micro organisms will sort your problem out.

[Prom]

Which BioBizz products are you using?

[Nacho]

How are you adjusting your PH? Would the soil not adjust the PH naturally? And from what I have read Biobizz products drop your water PH naturally as well. 

 

[Noobiegrow]

Hi guys, 

Thanks for the replies. I am using FF Microlife, Fish mix, Bio Grow, Root juice, Top max and Bio Bloom. 

After mixing the biobizz with my dechlorinated tap water the ph sits at around 6.7-6.8. I am adjusting it further using GH PH down to around 6-6.3.

I have also added EM Pro soil microbes too, in addition to the FF Microlife which is a product I really enjoy using.

I was applying one biobizz feed and then a light FF Microlife feed at every other watering. One feed, one micro. 

I have been quite zealous using the microbes, should I inoculate the soil further with additional microbes? 

Thanks for the help

[Noobiegrow]

@SkunkPharmThanks for your advice, I have just given the plants a feeding of Efficient Pro Soil, not sure how much I was supposed to use as the directions for application on the bottle are more suitable for commercial agriculture.

I applied 4ml/l and did not ph the mixture. 

Do you water till runoff or not? And how much do you let your soil dry out before watering again? 

Thanks a mil

[SkunkPharm]

I dont like to over water my plants. In veg I water about 500ml per day. At the moment I water 1.25l on one day and the other day I water with 500ml. I also monitor the bags. If they seem to heavy I skip a day. In my soil mix I use peat moss. It retains much more water than coco based soils. 

[CreX]

4 hours ago, Noobiegrow said:

@SkunkPharmThanks for your advice, I have just given the plants a feeding of Efficient Pro Soil, not sure how much I was supposed to use as the directions for application on the bottle are more suitable for commercial agriculture.

I applied 4ml/l and did not ph the mixture. 

Do you water till runoff or not? And how much do you let your soil dry out before watering again? 

Thanks a mil

That dilution is fine for the plants... Will work wonders. 

And weed likes a good wet to dry cycle. 

So you can rather err on a day later to water than a day sooner. 

[GGG]

FF Premium just goes for a few week then needs to be fed nutrients, the FF micro is a feed for bacteria if I understand the info on the website.

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[Burly]

Hi guys. Always I interesting reading and learning. 
 

I was wondering if anyone has heard if the Lukas method with GHE nutrients. The long of the short is a very simple feed to your coco mix and makes use of only the Flora micro and bloom bottles a long with Calmag if needed. 
 

ive seen great results on my crops with this simple feed. When it comes to a feeding schedule, I rather take more time to learn to read my plants during their different growth stages. Gas anyone tried this or synthetic feeds with FF soil the classic mix green bag? 

[Live Canna]

So I am using Freedom Farms normal organic soil, not the premium. I also noticed when I got my soil PH metre and also tested run off with my PH pen that my soil is sitting around 7.0 to 7.1. I have been watering around 5.8 - 6.2. But as you rightly say, Freedom Farms recommend 5.5 - 6.0 and this is because they have it buffered or something against lower PH, but not high. So I think if you water below 6.0 you will get into the right range. 7.0 is not horrible, but a few 0.1s lower would be better.

I am also using BioBizz. Plants look nice and healthy on my end, no deficiencies. I use Grow and Bloom. With grow alone I still need to drop the PH and I just use Lemon Juice for that, nice and organic in a sense  

Here is the excerpt. 

Ideal watering pH for Freedom Farms Craft Soils

Ideal pH 5.5 – 6.0

Pure coconut coir has a pH between 5.8 – 6.8. A substrate/soil pH of between 5.5 and 6.5 is ideal for plant nutrient uptake under both organic and inorganic fertiliser regimes.

Freedom Farms Coco coir is buffered and charged with natural amendments. The high Calcium content of our amendments maintains the pH in the 6.5-6.8 range and will prevent a decrease in pH (substrate acidification) resulting from fertiliser application or waterings at a low pH. The soil pH is therefore buffered against decreasing pH.

On the other hand, an incremental increase in pH resulting from tap water (pH 7-8.5) use can cause the soil pH to increase above the optimal range for nutrient uptake. The soil pH is therefore not buffered against increasing pH caused by using un-pH’d tap water. Watering with a pH of 5.5-6.0 will ensure the pH of the soil remains in the optimal range of 5.5-6.5.

[GGG]

I have been using the craft soil in a few grows and when I water like the above I have no problems, even when I add FF Probiotics that drops the pH to 4,8 its all fine and I did question it with FF. Watering Above PH6 migh give you issues. Add some tea's or molasses for the microbes.

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[greenkush]

In pure coco, I go in at 6.1-6.3, in FF classic i go from 5.8-6.1. I don't use biobizz though.

Edited July 30, 2020 by greenkush

[Noobiegrow]

@GGGThanks for the informative info above. Based on the advice given in the thread by other members, I started supplementing with microbes and also dropped my watering PH.

I have been using Microlife to adjust my ph as I discovered it's very acidic and a few ml's/l seems to do the trick. 

After persisting with the microbial consortiums and the lower ph, the plants bounced back and made a full recovery. 

I have since then starting mixing my own ammended coco using a version of @Totemic recipe that I found on the forum.

I noticed that I suffer from COWS(chronic over watering syndrome) and that traditional soils held moisture too long for the manner in which I was fertigating. 

I don't think I will ever consider procuring store bought soil again, as it has made a tremendous difference for my application. 

I now run a ph of 6.5-6.8 and I have moved away from using Biobizz for the veg cycle and instead I use a type of compost tea/extraction that I have experimented with and it works great. 

On the soil front I use the following :

The mix is per 15l pot so adjust if necessary for ur applications:

15l 90/10 coco perlite

15 tablespoons medium perlite 

8 tablespoons vermiculite 

8 tablespoons of worm castings 

6 tablespoons of turbo grow rock dust 

4 tablespoons of powdered kelp meal

2 tablespoons of kelp flakes

2 tablespoons of bokashi

1 teaspoon of Epsom salts 

2 tablespoons of Bio Ocean pelletised fertilizer 

I do not add any lime or gypsum to buffer the medium, and results have been great so far. 

For the compost extraction/leachate I use the following :

7l dechlorinated water

2 tablespoons earthworm castings

2 tablespoons bokashi

2 tablespoons Bio Ocean fertilizer 

1 tablespoons Gromor Accelerator fertilizer 

1 tablespoon blackstrap molasses

10ml EmPro soil microbes

After 24hrs I have a good layer of foam on the surface and my ppm is around 1000ppm. Ph comes in a little high at around 7.2. I know some growers don't consider ph crucial when growing organically but I add a little Microlife to bring it down to around 6.7-6.8.

Not sure if this helps, but it has been working great for me so far and I thought I would share it for anyone else who wants to give it a shot. 

 

[Noobiegrow]

@Live CannaThanks for the insert,i also popped them an email a while back and got the same info.

I totally agree that their soil is aggressively buffered and their ph watering regime has to be followed to obtain optimum results - in my limited experience that is 

How often do u feed them biobizz and what's ur dilution ratio? Ml/l? 

 

[Burly]

Hi guys. 
thanks for the thread. 
I’m using FF green bag with Biobizz grow and bloom with fish kelp by FF and Biodyne Environoc 401 Microbes ( is this the same as microlife from FF?). I’m seeing a bit of yellowing in the start of flowering. Would you suggest I add FF probiotics to my one a week feed of Biodyne. Again Is the FF microlife basically the same as Biodyne, the reason I ask is Ive run out the past few days and would like to know if I can use FF microlife as I can get some quicker than Biodyne??

 

thanks guys. 

Edited July 30, 2020 by Burly
Correcting

[GGG]

@Burly, to my understanding the FF Micro is to feed bacteria and the probiotics is the bacteria. I have experience with a full grow with the green bag as I just use it for rooted clones till it runs out of nutrients (2-4 weeks). With the custom soil I did a full grow with only Ph'd water and worked nice.

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[Burly]

[Burly]

Just now, Burly said:

They not looking happy gents. A bit of wilting and lime green color coming through on leaves 

should I just stick with Biobizz grow and bloom and then once a week with Biodyne?

[Noobiegrow]

@Burly As @GGGhas rightly said, the microlife is a fermented molasses and fish hydrosolate that feeds the microbes. It is enriched with Em1 but you'd be better off supplementing with a proper consortium such as ExploGrow. I personally use EmPro soil as it is affordable and has worked great for me so far.

@Burlywhat are  your rh and temps?

How often are you feeding them Biobizz? 

[Burly]

I feed Biobizz every watering and Ph is at 6.2 and 6.5 before feeding. Room RH is a steady 55-60% temps are 25 and 18 

this is my first run with Biobizz organic and FF soil. I normally run coco and salt based nutrients. All was going well in veg just ph watering for 4 weeks ( running autos)
So now in flowering and upped my bloom slowly and grow and have not given anything else for two weeks besides grow and bloom. I don’t have enough Biodyne that’s why I’m wondering if I should and can use FF microlife and if probiotics from them should also be added. Sorry this run is confusing the shit out of me. 

Edited July 30, 2020 by Burly
Correct

[Burly]

4 minutes ago, Burly said:

I feed Biobizz every watering and Ph is at 6.2 and 6.5 before feeding. Room RH is a steady 55-60% temps are 25 and 18 

this is my first run with Biobizz organic and FF soil. I normally run coco and salt based nutrients. All was going well in veg just ph watering for 4 weeks ( running autos)
So now in flowering and upped my bloom slowly and grow and have not given anything else for two weeks besides grow and bloom. I don’t have enough Biodyne that’s why I’m wondering if I should and can use FF microlife and if probiotics from them should also be added. Sorry this run is confusing the shit out of me. 

I might just go back to coco after this and use Biobizz again? 
I also ask about the FF products because I’m about to run out and buy today but don’t know what I should be adding to my grow and bloom. Your advice on products would be awesome. I can get Biodyne and Ff microlife and probiotics, what do you suggest. I do have kelp and molasses but the grow has molasses in it already so I don’t give to much of that when feeding. 

Edited July 30, 2020 by Burly

[Noobiegrow]

@BurlyTry dropping ur ph to 5.5-5.9 and see if the lockout subsides.

As mentioned above, that soil is aggressively buffered so ul have to follow their ph regime to get the right ph in the medium. Try measuring ur runoff or medium ph to give u an indication of where you are. 

Get the Biodyne and black strap molasses if u can. 

I have personally used biobizz and I am not crazy about their macro nutrient offerings. 

 

[Burly]

Thanks a mill mate. I’ll get the two suggested right away and drop that PH ASAP. 
 

So just to check with you, I’ll feed Biobizz every watering but at lease one or twice a week mix Biodyne and molasses together and feed? Ph at the above mentioned and then keep feeding until “flush” 

thanks for taking the time dude. 

[Noobiegrow]

My GSR genetics run on the soil mix mentioned above and compost tea. No bottle nutes and girls seem proper happy so far. Also, trying square to round long pots for this run