Indoor First Grow - When to Flip

[PeeWee]

Good day.

Just looking dor any advise.

See picture 2 July (plants was few weeks old).

See second pictures taken today 13 August.

 

That growth ok for 6 weeks later?

 

Currently running 18/6. 

• One Quantum Board ... I know I need another one.

Using no fan or heater.

 

When do I need to switch to flower? 12/12?

 

Can someone perhaps advise me if the last picture resembles a female? Or still to early to tell?

 

The reason why the plants sizes differ (trying different stuff out).

 

Any advice will be much appreciated.

 

Regards,

[TheUltimateNoob]

Good day.
Just looking dor any advise.
See picture 2 July (plants was few weeks old).
See second pictures taken today 13 August.
 
That growth ok for 6 weeks later?
 
Currently running 18/6. 

• One Quantum Board ... I know I need another one.

Using no fan or heater.
 
When do I need to switch to flower? 12/12?
 
Can someone perhaps advise me if the last picture resembles a female? Or still to early to tell?
 
The reason why the plants sizes differ (trying different stuff out).
 
Any advice will be much appreciated.
 
Regards,

Waddup bro..
Okay, I'm sure everyone has a lot of advice for you, but first let's work on what you need to know.

For 6 weeks, I would say that's just below average size for an untrained tree... Could've been bigger with more light, don't beat yourself up over it, other things make a difference as well.

As to whether they're female, take pics of the to-be bud site, not where the fan leaf meets the main stem... We need to look for pistils or sacs at this point, not really preflowers - since they're 6 weeks old, they're most likely mature already.

If those were mine, I would consider topping them once, using some LST, then veg for another week or slightly more and initiate flowering after that.
Reason being to control height and get more than 3 main colas from 3 trees.

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[Naughty.Psychonaut]

On 8/13/2020 at 4:49 PM, PeeWee said:

 

 

 

What's good, bud!

Seems like some discolouration on the leaves of the big girl there? Maybe a deficiency, perhaps root stress. 

Deficiencies are caused by lack of nutes, or it could be that excessive nutes harmed the roots and now they block out that nute completely resulting in the plant showing the same signs as deficiency. 

You feeding them?

If so, how much?

If not, start. 

What's the white stuff on top of the soil? 

Make sure whatever it is, it's not leaching compounds into your soil. 

I would look into sorting out that before investing all the time and energy to get the plant to flower and then turn its back on you later on.

Big impact on plant size is pot size, if the roots can't move neither will the plant.

I agree with @TheUltimateNoob, top them, wait a week, open them up by tying them down. The big girl I'll chop a bit lower, at the 4th node or so from the bottom should be good. Make a cutting from the top you cut away. 

[PsyCLown]

I would let the plants grow a bit bigger and do some training before flipping.

Also repot into 20L pots.

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[PeeWee]

Hi thanks for the advice.

 

Two weeks ago I gave these as indicated on label... see picture... the week after only water. This week gave those again.

 

The White stuff is small garden stones... to keep the bugs off the soil.

 

Should I top the bigger one as shown in picture... above 5th node? Should I top the other two aswell?

 

The two bigger pots at the back are 27cm pots... not small. Only the one in front is small... only had two big ones.... I will put that one in bigger pot.

 Thanks again for all the advice.

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

@PeeWee

So the garden stones won't be a problem and will defs help with the bugs. I like that you didn't use bark or some kinda decomposable matter. 

The pyrol I would suggest only spraying when you see a fungi outbreak or insect invasion. It's good for curbing those kinda problems in the early stages, but I don't think it can be used to wipe out infestations of any kind. Also should not be sprayed if there's nothing wrong with the plant. For preemtive care I would suggest BioNeem, which is the milder version of pyrol and wont do any harm, it also acts as a immune booster and a mild foliar feed. Which pyrol does not do. But on the other hand, if you have invasions or outbreaks the neem wil not be strong enough. 

What medium are you growing in?

Does it drain well, no water logging?

Do you let them dry between each watering?

Do you have a way of testing ph?

What's the table of contents on those bottles? NPK ratio?

With nutes like those (and obviously depending in the growing medium) I will feed the plant nothing untill I see it needs something, then start feeding at recommended dosages. No less. 

You can go even bigger than the 27cm pots. Just remember, bigger pot bigger plant. So if you want small plants, that's your choice, but just keep in mind for future purposes. I think those 27cm pot only hold about 10L of medium. 

47 minutes ago, PeeWee said:

 

 

 

 

 

You can go one or even two nodes down... once you top her, you have to open the side branches by tying them down, so the light can penetrate the plant and make more than one cola for you.

Topping a plant helps it bush out, so it's up to you. You wana grow a christmas tree shape or a bushy bush shape? 

[PeeWee]

Ok cool... will top it there or one down... if it is better to so it I’ll go for it... still got allot of space for height... but makes sense for better light.

Will google a bit to see where to tie the side branches.

Do I trim the side branches?

Growing medium.... see picture.

For now keeping them in those pots... my first grow.

Draining good... got run off.

Yes letting them dry.  

Have to buy a PH pen... any recommendations? One of these ... in pictures? 

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

@PeeWee 

Yes, if you got lots of space both sideways and up the dicision is all yours if you wana top or not. 

Once you're flowering you'll notice that the buds closest to the light will look the best, they'll become bigger than the buds elsewhere on the plant, sometimes frostier too! If you have a christmas tree shape plant you gona have one big cola right by the light and the rest of the plant too far away and hidden away under the rest of the plant. Some guys have great success with christmas trees, but I prefer a uniform yield rather than few big buds and lots of mid quality buds. I am trying a scrog for the first time right now, but my canopy is uneven as fuuuck

In a little while when I get home and my lights are on I'll show you how I tie mine down. Super easy. Few paper binders from the write shop and garden wire from any nursery even some checkers and spars and those big retail shops have garden wire. 

I have no experience with organics matter soil myself, but have read lots of good things about it here on the forum. I would highly recommend getting some microbial inoculant such as mycoroot, trichoderma, biodyne, explogro. To keep the microbes thriving keep a bottle of molasses on hand. Always. That soil has everything cannabis plants needs, but also good to maybe keep a few biobizz nutes on hand. They really help alot when plants act up in living soil. 

About the ph meter, I can highly recommend the bluelabs equipment, all of it hahah! Got their ph and ppm pen and never given a hickup. Only had it for about 2 years now though. I have heard and seen people using that yellow one in the second pic, but they say they're like throw away testers. They last a year or two and when they start giving trouble with calibration and to get them fixed would cost the same as getting a new one. So this is one of those times where buying cheap will cost you more, but this is only really so if you're a hydro grower that need use ph and ppm pens much more often. As soil growers we need a soil ph probe. 

I was asking about the probe, cause you can test what the water is when you give it and thest the runoff and that will kinda indicate what the soil ph is. Although it should regulate itself, being a living soil, it can swing for many reason. It should be between 6.3 and 7.3.

About the drainage, do you water till run off each time or only with the clean water? Do you let the plant sit in the run or do you throw it out?

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

Oh wait, it's not organics matter soil, it's grow station. Have not heard of many people using that as their "go to soil". The contents look right though, it's not barky? 

Just for the sake of experimenting, maybe give the ff premium mix or the just cannabis bags a go next time?

Maybe check if you can see anything on the forum about people growing in that soil and see what they experienced..

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

This is how I tie my branches down. 

Are you using plastic pots? Kinda looks like terra cotta? 

[PeeWee]

Ok cool... will try that.

By when will I be able to determine the sex?

A bit later?

Thanks again!

[afternoon blazer]

Just keep looking for pistols.

U can stress the plant into flower to determine. By increasing dark period.

 

Are those bag seeds or did u get some good genetics?

[PeeWee]

Bag seeds... thought just as a First Grow I would try them... regretting a bit that I didn’t use the proper feminized seeds I have... I should probably increase the dark time now... and start over again. Currently on 18/6. Must I go over to 12/12?

[afternoon blazer]

3 minutes ago, PeeWee said:

Bag seeds... thought just as a First Grow I would try them... regretting a bit that I didn’t use the proper feminized seeds I have... I should probably increase the dark time now... and start over again. Currently on 18/6. Must I go over to 12/12?

Yeah. I think thats a good option ti force the plant into flower. 

 

If u start seeing anything like little balls or sacks starting to form. Then its probably male. Anything that looks like tiny white hairs. . . Then its female.

If u got both. Then thats another story. But lets look for the first 2 indications before we get into that.

@TheUltimateNoob @Ill_Evan @CreX @StickyD420

Any advise to stress the plant to determine sex for our brobeans here.

[The_StonedTrooper]

I dont know about stress, that is something you stay away from with regards to flowering, other than training, which I feel is different to what you are asking.

You can push the plant into flowering, by making it 12/12 light to dark, or post a pic of the plant, close up of the area you edited yellow, so we can see again. I cant tell from the first pictures. 

With a pH pen you want to keep the bulb on any of them wet, with storage solution, or they will dry and you will have issues with calibration later on, no matter the money spent on them, its simple. You can check LEApH out on Facebook 

Also with bag seed you have no idea what you getting in terms of quality, as the plant may have been one thing and you have no idea is it crossed with something else or has a tendency to hermie or go ape on you, and throw deficiency symptoms and make you think you doing something wrong. 

We are all here to help brother

[PeeWee]

Did not Top it.

Looks so nice.

Can I only determine sex in flower? Going to wait another week before going to 12/12.

[The_StonedTrooper]

Get a lekker shot close up of the bud site, at the cross where the branches meet the stem.

[afternoon blazer]

Well cant argue with u there. They do look really nice. I feel u. Looks so good that u dont wana interfere. .

Just keep looking for those white hairs bro. Should be visible in the next few days. 

 

Great job so far.

[PsyCLown]

Did not Top it.

Looks so nice.

Can I only determine sex in flower? Going to wait another week before going to 12/12.

Look at the colouring on your leaves, plants don't look happy.

Have you been adjusting the PH on your feed?

 

Edit: you also don't wanna stress the plant, if you want to see the sex flip to flower or wait a bit longer and she if you get any pre-flower pistils.

I'd suggest wait until you're happy to flip them, then flip to flower and monitor during week 2 and 3. Anything with pollen sacs can be tossed. Flipping to flower to determine sex, then back to veg will just slow down your grow a looot.

 

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[PeeWee]

Ok tomorrow 12 weeks... I know they not the biggest. My very first time... made some mistakes. 
 

The two bigger ones in 10liter pots... the smaller one in a small pot.

 

Taller ones 45cm high.

Should I flip them now?
 

Yes some older leaves not the right colour (gave nutrients a while back).

 

Currently just giving water every 3/4 days.

[PsyCLown]

I'd say get your plants right first before flipping to flower.

They still do not look happy and the slow growth is further proof of this.

 

I also like to pot up to 20l pots, I use those are my final pots.

Plants look as if they're being burnt.

[PsyCLown]

I feel as if your soil is the cause of the issues,  it may be worth while buying some soil which is more suited to growing cannabis.

Freedom farms is popular and easily available, your plants may take a knock with the transplant as I'd suggest you try and get a bit of the current soil off the roots (putting the plant in a bucket of water makes this a bit easier and I feel helps reduce damage to the roots. You won't ever get all the soil off without damaging the plant, but try get as much off as easily possible.

 

Give the plants a week or so to recover, monitor new growth and see how they are doing then. Once you get the plants dialed in, growth should be explosive as they're getting bigger and should be growing quicker now.

[PeeWee]

If this colour is wrong... what colour should they be? The light shines a bit yellowish... 

[PsyCLown]

The leaf in the last pic looks good.

The tips of the leaves look as if they are clawing a bit though, in some of your earlier pics the tips look burnt as well - a sign of too much nutes.

[PeeWee]

Yes on two occasions I gave nutes... but after the discoloring of the leaves I stopped... all the top leaves looks good.

Just giving water.