Sublimation Cure

[Marzcanna]

So what is Sublimation?

 

Well in short, sublimation is a process during which a solid is turned into a gas, skipping the liquid stage in between. Controlled radiant heat is applied during this process, converting the frozen moisture in the product directly into vapor.

Okay, but what does that actually mean? It means you can cure your cannabis through freezing technique, one such famous technique is cyro cure / cyro freeze. 

"Cryo Cure’s patent-pending cannabis drying and curing process gives harvested cannabis that “fresh from the farm” feeling, preserving the color, smell, and texture lost during the typical weekslong curing process. By skipping the hanging drying process, “Cryo Cured” cannabis evades human error that could ruin a harvest, increasing yield while delivering product to retail shelves faster than ever before in the cannabis industry."

HOW DOES THE CRYO CURE CANNABIS CURING MACHINE WORK & CAN YOU STIIL DO IT WITHOUT ONE?

 

STEP 01: FREEZING

The first step in the Cryo Cure process is to freeze the cannabis or industrial hemp to -20 to -30 degrees for no less than 10 hours to preserve the shape and integrity. Select Cryo Cure models have a built-in freezer for this purpose, or you can use a separate freezer that’s the right size and specifications for sub-critical temperatures

 

STEP 02: VACUUM PRESSURE

The now-frozen product is placed into the material chamber under vacuum pressure in order to facilitate sublimation.

 

STEP 03: SUBLIMATION

We already touched on this, this is when sublimation occurs

 

STEP 04 CONDENSATION:

The vapor is condensed back into a solid and collected in the ice bank

 

STEP 05 DEFROST:

The ice in the ice bank is melted and drained from the ice bank in the form of a hydrosol liquid. Any terpenes lost in the sublimation process can be reclaimed from the hydrosol to be used in other processed products such as vape pens and oils.

 

THATS ALL GREAT BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR THE AVARAGE JOE

 

As promising and innovating as that all sounds, not all of us have the financial backing to invest on a cryo-freeze machine.  BUT that's not the end of it, we can actually take the same principal and apply it using a "FROST-LESS" freezer. The outcome when done right is bigger and fresher bud with enhanced terpene profile & smell.

SO HOW CAN WE TRY TO REPLICATE IT?

This is what you wanna do....

Grab something like a small cardboard box or plastic container & place under your buds leaving buds open to air. Do not lay it on bare plastic, most of today's plastics aren't breathable in certain temps. Use some type of breathable material.
Leave it in the frost-less freezer for two weeks.

Don't touch them, if anything grab some tongs(lunch lady style) turn them each side one week each so both sides are exposed(VERY GENTLY TRICHS WILL FALL IN THESE TEMPS).

Third week take it out a hour a day before returning it into the freezer, after the 3rd week you may remove it OUT FREEZER & into jars to continue cure for a week+ or as normal

 

This method doesn't not replicate the cyro freeze in terms of speed that cryo freeze achieves at full cure in 24hrs, but it does somewhat replicate the preservation of weight and taste that you will never achieve with hang drying

 

NOTE: A "FROST-LESS" freezer is required, normal freezer will build-up frost on your buds damaging them & I would suggest you try it out with a small batch first 

 

 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Prom]

You can use dry ice to get to the same result. Very fast dry buds ^^

But still, only do it on "dry" days.. as soon as you take the cold buds out in very humid days, will condensate back on the buds very fast.

 

What you mean with: Third week, take it out an hour before returning it to the freezer? What would be the advantage?

 

I use dry ice to make hash.. but I prefer my weed to dry as slow as possible, if I want to smoke the buds.

[Marzcanna]

12 minutes ago, Prom said:

You can use dry ice to get to the same result. Very fast dry buds ^^

But still, only do it on "dry" days.. as soon as you take the cold buds out in very humid days, will condensate back on the buds very fast.

 

What you mean with: Third week, take it out an hour before returning it to the freezer? What would be the advantage?

 

I use dry ice to make hash.. but I prefer my weed to dry as slow as possible, if I want to smoke the buds.

Yes you can do it with the dry ice but the outcome is far from each other in terms of taste and smoke, hang dry cure vs dry ice vs water cure, hands down dry cure is best. Hands down frost-less freezer above it all. I only got it right the 2nd time of trying but if my third time is the same as my 2nd time, I will cure all my buds this way, the taste is nothing like anything I ever tasted. 

According to the original source, leaving it an hour a day is achieving the condensation & defrost steps

[Nope]

How does using this process increase the yield? 

[Marzcanna]

3 minutes ago, Adansonia digitata said:

How does using this process increase the yield? 

Doesn't increase the intial yield it preserves the wet weight of your buds. When you hang dry you can lose up 50% of your weight

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[CreX]

but.... bud is around 80% water... how can you preserve the weight...without preserving water weight as well?

[Marzcanna]

18 minutes ago, CreX said:

but.... bud is around 80% water... how can you preserve the weight...without preserving water weight as well?

It's probly the same way how cryo freeze preserves the weight and taste with full cure within 24hrs. You will have to do some research on cryo freeze to understand the reasons for frost-less freezer, there's a book out covering it very well as on the international forums. I'm not on how's and whys it works except it does. it's a highly debateable topic all over due to its nature. At first I also thought what alot of BS, 15 years growing, I've tried all the curing method out there so ofcuz I thought this was too good to be true but you have to try it to be able to give an opinion so that's what I did and after trying the first time with fail you would think that was enough, however I found out I did a few things wrong the first time, so I did it a 2nd time,  I found out why some swear by it , take a gram and try it for yourself and let us know here. I will try it a 3rd time and if it's anything like the last cure, I will only cure this way . If you want to further understand this method search Sublimation using a frost-less freezer, and cryo freeze 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Prom]

Curing is based on friction, humidity, light and temperature. If you go to dry, your weed will not cure anymore.. how you know when you are done? curing happens when you have enough water still present.. but not enough to let mold form.. the mold not stopping the curing.. but hinders you from smoking it.

I had a quick read.. you find all from: makes weed taste better to.. makes it taste like hay. Only way I see to not mess things up. Balance to 62%, put in a vacuum tight container and then freeze it to store... but why pump energy in something that isn't really needed? I cure with bags and have humidity sensors inside the jar.

If your bags get crystalline from remoistening dryer batches, just put em in a empty jar with a wet cotton ball. Boveda bags you can use till they hit mold.. then I would dump the bag. A very full bag is also not reducing humidity anymore.. can use those bags also to get more moisture in a dry bag.

Once a jar is on 62% for 2 weeks, I take out the bag(s) and sensor and clean lid and top to have a very air tight closure. Then store in a new, unused fridge.. I just don't have on power ^^ dark, air tight and the plastic they use is usually microbe resistant, plus keep temp quite constant inside. The sensors tell you if you are in the green.. over 68% you take the weed out and put it back on a drying frame for 12 hours.. then check again. Let the jars rest for 24 hours before you take the reading.. takes a bit to even out moisture.

[Marzcanna]

16 minutes ago, Prom said:

Curing is based on friction, humidity, light and temperature. If you go to dry, your weed will not cure anymore.. how you know when you are done? curing happens when you have enough water still present.. but not enough to let mold form.. the mold not stopping the curing.. but hinders you from smoking it.

I had a quick read.. you find all from: makes weed taste better to.. makes it taste like hay. Only way I see to not mess things up. Balance to 62%, put in a vacuum tight container and then freeze it to store... but why pump energy in something that isn't really needed? I cure with bags and have humidity sensors inside the jar.

If your bags get crystalline from remoistening dryer batches, just put em in a empty jar with a wet cotton ball. Boveda bags you can use till they hit mold.. then I would dump the bag. A very full bag is also not reducing humidity anymore.. can use those bags also to get more moisture in a dry bag.

Once a jar is on 62% for 2 weeks, I take out the bag(s) and sensor and clean lid and top to have a very air tight closure. Then store in a new, unused fridge.. I just don't have on power ^^ dark, air tight and the plastic they use is usually microbe resistant, plus keep temp quite constant inside. The sensors tell you if you are in the green.. over 68% you take the weed out and put it back on a drying frame for 12 hours.. then check again. Let the jars rest for 24 hours before you take the reading.. takes a bit to even out moisture.

Sounds about right almost how I cure my stuff. Let it air dry put in a jar once its around 65% Rh anything above bud must come out, keep burping as normal until it reaches 60%, 58% for long term storage. There's even a technique to jar them a day to bring out moisture if your buds dry out within two days. It will help but you will still except to get the hay taste. Which in some cases you can make it better with longer curing but it still stays, only thing that's actually improves is the smoke, once the chlorophyll locks due to quick dry you will always have that hay smell and taste. I have tried the fridge cure, I think it's more of a preference. Dry ice and water cure is something I won't be doing again 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Prom]

I will give it a try.. next batch of harvest I let a plant go freezer and see 

 

And a word to water curing... if you have a light moldy batch, this can save the smoke, not the taste.

As much as I agree that water curing provides a very smooth smoke in a week.. it also kills all tastes and flavors you had in there.. really.. dump it before you water cure.. or you are very very desperate to just smoke something 

[Marzcanna]

22 minutes ago, Prom said:

I will give it a try.. next batch of harvest I let a plant go freezer and see 

 

And a word to water curing... if you have a light moldy batch, this can save the smoke, not the taste.

As much as I agree that water curing provides a very smooth smoke in a week.. it also kills all tastes and flavors you had in there.. really.. dump it before you water cure.. or you are very very desperate to just smoke something 

agreed, water curing has its place to save some buds if you had powdery mildew, but I would also use it as a last resort, agreed smoke is smoother but taste is gone, worse case if you have no choice to either save bud or throw it away, than water cure it. Atleast you won't lose out on your hard work but if it's only a small batch than it's not even worth it. Give the frost-less freezer method a try, but I have to point out that is must be a frost-less freezer. Most modern fridges with built in freezer are frost-less but I'd advise anyone trying this to make sure of that first 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Prom]

you have a link to one of those? ^^ 

[The_StonedTrooper]

1 hour ago, Prom said:

Curing is based on friction, humidity, light and temperature. If you go to dry, your weed will not cure anymore.. how you know when you are done? curing happens when you have enough water still present.. but not enough to let mold form.. the mold not stopping the curing.. but hinders you from smoking it.

I had a quick read.. you find all from: makes weed taste better to.. makes it taste like hay. Only way I see to not mess things up. Balance to 62%, put in a vacuum tight container and then freeze it to store... but why pump energy in something that isn't really needed? I cure with bags and have humidity sensors inside the jar.

If your bags get crystalline from remoistening dryer batches, just put em in a empty jar with a wet cotton ball. Boveda bags you can use till they hit mold.. then I would dump the bag. A very full bag is also not reducing humidity anymore.. can use those bags also to get more moisture in a dry bag.

Once a jar is on 62% for 2 weeks, I take out the bag(s) and sensor and clean lid and top to have a very air tight closure. Then store in a new, unused fridge.. I just don't have on power ^^ dark, air tight and the plastic they use is usually microbe resistant, plus keep temp quite constant inside. The sensors tell you if you are in the green.. over 68% you take the weed out and put it back on a drying frame for 12 hours.. then check again. Let the jars rest for 24 hours before you take the reading.. takes a bit to even out moisture.

Signs of a person who is well educated and knowledgeable, you have the complete correct understanding of the dry and cure process Prom. I fully back this up and follow this religiously on my dry and cure.

Removing the chlorophyll from the plant can only be done slowly, and if you dont remove it, you smoke it. Makes a harsh and more bitter smoke. Rushing or freezing it, will lock that moisture and chlorophyll in and trap it.

[Prom]

15 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Removing the chlorophyll from the plant can only be done slowly, and if you dont remove it, you smoke it. Makes a harsh and more bitter smoke. Rushing or freezing it, will lock that moisture and chlorophyll in and trap it.

Freezing will dry up the weed, if you do not put it in a vacuum tight container. Sublimation will always go till the air around is saturated, max it can take on. As storing weed longterm in freezers is common practice... works if done correctly... i never heard it improves the taste, what is a interesting point. As said, willed to test it, as i never tried it  nothing wrong with more taste. Question is, how much is such a freezer? 

[The_StonedTrooper]

16 minutes ago, Prom said:

Freezing will dry up the weed, if you do not put it in a vacuum tight container.

Exactly, too fast I'd guess and leave behind some of the colour, being the chlorophyll. That stuff isn't great inside you, burnt too.

16 minutes ago, Prom said:

  nothing wrong with more taste. Question is, how much is such a freezer? 

Nothing at all wrong with more taste but as you mentioned, what the cost implications of this taste and are they worth the added?

Edited April 21, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper
Typo

[Marzcanna]

unfortunately no links to such units, im fortunate enough to have bought a 2020 fridge with built in freezer which happens to be frost-less

[Marzcanna]

44 minutes ago, Prom said:

Freezing will dry up the weed, if you do not put it in a vacuum tight container. Sublimation will always go till the air around is saturated, max it can take on. As storing weed longterm in freezers is common practice... works if done correctly... i never heard it improves the taste, what is a interesting point. As said, willed to test it, as i never tried it  nothing wrong with more taste. Question is, how much is such a freezer? 

I dont think we allowed to link to other forums but there a certain international forum, with this same topic and people getting heated over it, its a few pages long but if you read through it, alot of the people who didn't think would work actually commented back saying it actually works. I agree with all of what you saying hence why i was one of the guys on that forum throwing smoke at the people for the same reasons as you mentioned, the truth is you have to try it, dont know why but it seems to work better than hang dry. And we all agree that slow dry is the way to go, no questions about it but for some strange reason this method has worked for many better than hang drying, and if im too judge on my 2nd try i will have to agree

[Marzcanna]

1 hour ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Signs of a person who is well educated and knowledgeable, you have the complete correct understanding of the dry and cure process Prom. I fully back this up and follow this religiously on my dry and cure.

Removing the chlorophyll from the plant can only be done slowly, and if you dont remove it, you smoke it. Makes a harsh and more bitter smoke. Rushing or freezing it, will lock that moisture and chlorophyll in and trap it.

In theory yes, compared to most techniques / curing methods yes

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Marzcanna]

Found a good video describing cryo freeze technology better its actually an ad for cryo cure 

Cryo Cure Video

[Prom]

Pricy 

https://africansmoke.co.za/store/Harvest-Right-Freeze-Dryer-p175437022

[The_StonedTrooper]

29 minutes ago, Prom said:

Pricy 

https://africansmoke.co.za/store/Harvest-Right-Freeze-Dryer-p175437022

You getting 2 of them

That isn't playing around, I mean, it's only going to dry your cannabis

Added, for another 22k you get the oil free pump on top of the 85k

Edited April 21, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper
Added

[Marzcanna]

50 minutes ago, Prom said:

Pricy 

https://africansmoke.co.za/store/Harvest-Right-Freeze-Dryer-p175437022

That's the freeze dryer, its the cheaper version of the cryo cure machine if I'm not mistaken. This type of machines cost alot of money. Let me try the frost - less method, 3rd times the charm and I ll update

[Marzcanna]

24 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

You getting 2 of them

That isn't playing around, I mean, it's only going to dry your cannabis

Added, for another 22k you get the oil free pump on top of the 85k

Yes the oil pump is a nice feature, it's like having a swimming pool to your house or sunroof to your car. Gota get the pump

Edited April 21, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Marzcanna]

ALRIGHT THAN! 

Since im harvesting today, i thought id return to this thread and try it out and post the results once I'm done. I have found the link to its original thread, *Note To admin* (Feel free to remove link if needed) The thread is quite long ive been active on it for some time and alot of its users return to the thread with success. If you have the time and really want to try this method id suggest reading the first 5 pages

 

Curing-nug-the-right-way

Edited June 20, 2021 by Marzcanna

[Marzcanna]

Quick update:

So to test this thing I took a few pop corn buds off a brunch of some of the plants and removed only fan leaves and some suger leaves, I laid them inside a coffee filter and threw them into the "frost-less" freezer. 

Here we have blue dream, power plant and aurora

They went into the freezer for 2 weeks. 

 

We are now at week 3 and removing them for an hour each day for a week before putting them in jars 

What I found so far is that they do seem to keep their mass somewhat. The smell starts to come in hard after 15min out of the freezer. Smells like what they should smell like nothing out of the ordinary. 

 

So far so good to be honest. But the true test will be in the smoke and taste. 

We will continue to take them out of the freezer for an hour each day, by the end of the week they will be in jars for a further 2 weeks before we do a smoke test...