Best Soil Mix Of 2021

[The_StonedTrooper]

The thing for me was this, 

I walked into a grow shop in PE, looking to purchase the FF soil in green bags, and saw the bag open and mostly dry.

Seeing that bag, I saw plenty coco, and thought to myself, I can make coco at home, way cheaper, so I did. (Same ingredients).

Then next time, I bought more for the coco to make a proper living soil, that was breathable like coco, but had the goodness of a soil, and stuff for the Microbes to feast on, so similar to OrgaSoilux actually, bar the Guano and a few things changed out.

The grow from start to finish for me is effortless and add water and Microbes, the plants finish up dying, and I have an incredible high and flavorful smoke, every time. 

Pull the roots out and pop the next in its place and add my goods to the soil top, and round 2, 3, 4 and so on.

So happy I dont have to purchase nutrients again and worry about PPM or TDS and even pH.

I know my plants are ready, when they have no more leaves left. As below pic

Edited May 21, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper
Typo

[Green]

As a beginner, I found FF premium classic very forgiving. It seems to have the perfect balance of everything. In combination with a fabric pot it handles over and under watering very well. It says on the bag 'not recommended for germinating seeds' but I've had 100% success rate so far with paper towel method straight into Freedom Farm soil. 

So far I've always added liquid nutrients after a month. This year's outdoor grow I'm going to try it amended with Dirty Hands elemental blend (and mycoroot), a few top dresses and pH'd water.

One note on this soil though, it is MOSTLY coco and perlite so it can dry out VERY quickly outdoors in fabric pots, especially in smaller pots and in the middle of a hot and windy summer **cape town** I've heard you can line the inside top half of the pots with plastic, to retain moisture while still air pruning the roots.

[Thrive]

As a late comer to this poll, am I allowed to suggest our own soil, Thrive Living Soil from www.thrivecentre.co.za ? We tend to find that a lot of soil producers try to throw the kitchen sink into a soil, without really understanding what elements do what. The whole "bullshit baffles brains" approach. So, for instance rock dust can stall your plants if you haven't also included indigenous microbes collected during the winter months. That is because indigenous soil microbes move deeper down in the soil layers during winter, in order to decompose the tougher mineral matter, versus more usual organic matter in summer months.

Some of the key components to get right are obviously your base NPK ratio. We aim for around 6:3:2 with a strong and sustained Nitrogen boost for initial growth, and then a slower and more sustained release of Phosphorous and Potassium for fruiting and flowering. Getting the timing right is important and that's where the inoculated biochar comes into play. It's also important that the composting process introduces living, microbial matter into the soil food web, and that it finds a home in the biochar, establishing a symbiotic relationship with the plant roots. A good living soil should give you at least 2 full strong growths without refeeding with compost and/or organic fertilisers. Although you really want to be feeding and fertilising your soil, and not the plant i.e. the plant needs to talk to the soil for what it needs, and not let the human try and force feed the plant.  

We are exceptionally lucky in that our soils have excellent natural mycelium and perfect pH for cannabis, developed over thousands of years in Hogsback. That is something that no soil producer can ever reproduce on their own.  We also produce most of our own amendments, such as our oak and bamboo biochar (Japanese style) which also gives us superb wood vinegar. This is not that well known in South Africa but wood vinegar is probably your number one all-round Natural insecticide and fungicide. As far as I know we are the only ones producing it in SA, as not that many have sustainable oak and bamboo resources. It is Nature's own plant immune booster, root growth stimulant and flavour enhancer. You can read more about it at www.woodvinegar.org 

[SAgrower]

As a late comer to this poll, am I allowed to suggest our own soil, Thrive Living Soil from www.thrivecentre.co.za ? We tend to find that a lot of soil producers try to throw the kitchen sink into a soil, without really understanding what elements do what. The whole "bullshit baffles brains" approach. So, for instance rock dust can stall your plants if you haven't also included indigenous microbes collected during the winter months. That is because indigenous soil microbes move deeper down in the soil layers during winter, in order to decompose the tougher mineral matter, versus more usual organic matter in summer months.
Some of the key components to get right are obviously your base NPK ratio. We aim for around 6:3:2 with a strong and sustained Nitrogen boost for initial growth, and then a slower and more sustained release of Phosphorous and Potassium for fruiting and flowering. Getting the timing right is important and that's where the inoculated biochar comes into play. It's also important that the composting process introduces living, microbial matter into the soil food web, and that it finds a home in the biochar, establishing a symbiotic relationship with the plant roots. A good living soil should give you at least 2 full strong growths without refeeding with compost and/or organic fertilisers. Although you really want to be feeding and fertilising your soil, and not the plant i.e. the plant needs to talk to the soil for what it needs, and not let the human try and force feed the plant.  
We are exceptionally lucky in that our soils have excellent natural mycelium and perfect pH for cannabis, developed over thousands of years in Hogsback. That is something that no soil producer can ever reproduce on their own.  We also produce most of our own amendments, such as our oak and bamboo biochar (Japanese style) which also gives us superb wood vinegar. This is not that well known in South Africa but wood vinegar is probably your number one all-round Natural insecticide and fungicide. As far as I know we are the only ones producing it in SA, as not that many have sustainable oak and bamboo resources. It is Nature's own plant immune booster, root growth stimulant and flavour enhancer. You can read more about it at www.woodvinegar.org 

Wow, your prices are very very good. I will buy a couple of bags and test them out during this outdoor season.

[CoolJ]

40 minutes ago, SAgrower said:

1 hour ago, Thrive said:

As a late comer to this poll, am I allowed to suggest our own soil, Thrive Living Soil from www.thrivecentre.co.za ? We tend to find that a lot of soil producers try to throw the kitchen sink into a soil, without really understanding what elements do what. The whole "bullshit baffles brains" approach. So, for instance rock dust can stall your plants if you haven't also included indigenous microbes collected during the winter months. That is because indigenous soil microbes move deeper down in the soil layers during winter, in order to decompose the tougher mineral matter, versus more usual organic matter in summer months.
Some of the key components to get right are obviously your base NPK ratio. We aim for around 6:3:2 with a strong and sustained Nitrogen boost for initial growth, and then a slower and more sustained release of Phosphorous and Potassium for fruiting and flowering. Getting the timing right is important and that's where the inoculated biochar comes into play. It's also important that the composting process introduces living, microbial matter into the soil food web, and that it finds a home in the biochar, establishing a symbiotic relationship with the plant roots. A good living soil should give you at least 2 full strong growths without refeeding with compost and/or organic fertilisers. Although you really want to be feeding and fertilising your soil, and not the plant i.e. the plant needs to talk to the soil for what it needs, and not let the human try and force feed the plant.  
We are exceptionally lucky in that our soils have excellent natural mycelium and perfect pH for cannabis, developed over thousands of years in Hogsback. That is something that no soil producer can ever reproduce on their own.  We also produce most of our own amendments, such as our oak and bamboo biochar (Japanese style) which also gives us superb wood vinegar. This is not that well known in South Africa but wood vinegar is probably your number one all-round Natural insecticide and fungicide. As far as I know we are the only ones producing it in SA, as not that many have sustainable oak and bamboo resources. It is Nature's own plant immune booster, root growth stimulant and flavour enhancer. You can read more about it at www.woodvinegar.org 

Wow, your prices are very very good. I will buy a couple of bags and test them out during this outdoor season.

Same here man at that price its very good. @Thriveare you available in the Cape Town? 

[Thrive]

The reason our prices are good is because we keep our costs down and we believe in offering old-school value. No point ripping people off when you're trying to build a long-term business. Of course soil is not exactly the easiest thing to transport around the country. Ideally we would like to have agents around the country who can stock around R5 - R10k of product per delivery on consignment, and then make some extra cash marking it up for individual retail sales. But I don't want to hijack this thread further, so will place a classified advert for this. 

[The_StonedTrooper]

I'd really like to thank @Thrive for the visit today, it was a blessing to meet with you.

Cant wait to try the sample soil and give an honest side by side comparison.

There wasnt a doubt in my mind that I needed the Wood Vinegar, and bought one myself to try out, and have got such faith already in this product, in what it can achieve, that I have asked to be an ambassador and supplier of it, in the EC.

With safe application throughout flower...

Wouldnt you want your harvest to Thrive?

Edited August 2, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper

[Sticks]

On 7/11/2021 at 10:22 AM, Green said:

As a beginner, I found FF premium classic very forgiving. It seems to have the perfect balance of everything. In combination with a fabric pot it handles over and under watering very well. It says on the bag 'not recommended for germinating seeds' but I've had 100% success rate so far with paper towel method straight into Freedom Farm soil. 

So far I've always added liquid nutrients after a month. This year's outdoor grow I'm going to try it amended with Dirty Hands elemental blend (and mycoroot), a few top dresses and pH'd water.

One note on this soil though, it is MOSTLY coco and perlite so it can dry out VERY quickly outdoors in fabric pots, especially in smaller pots and in the middle of a hot and windy summer **cape town** I've heard you can line the inside top half of the pots with plastic, to retain moisture while still air pruning the roots.

I also use FF premium classic and also have zero problems germinating in them. I repot twice in veg, so no need for nutes. On the second repotting I mix some FF & Elemental blend into the bottom of my final pot at a ratio of 3 parts FF to 1 Part Elemental blend and let the plants recover for a week, then i flip them. And again, like you, I top dress in week 4 of flower with the same ratio of FF to Elemental blend. Seems to be working for me. 

I also add lots of perlite to the FF as I find it tends to compact after a few weeks. 

 

I even use the FF to make a pseudo compost tea once a week.

 

Would like to try the Orgasoil next, though. 

[Stinger96]

Nice.. Can I ask in my limited experience and knowledge of these things.. What do you use it for..?

[The_StonedTrooper]

36 minutes ago, Stinger96 said:

Nice.. Can I ask in my limited experience and knowledge of these things.. What do you use it for..?

Hey brother, I'll take a chance and are you asking about the wood vinegar?

It's got a multitude of uses actually, my main need and use for this will be in order of preference...

1. For PM right up through flowering. 

2. Foliar feed while doing the above, adding flavour, smell and amount of fruits, and or flower (used in Orchid's and farming)

I will be doing the test runs and currently have one plant I've run 2 times, and running the third now, and was an issue with PM, so this will be a good in practice run. 

I shall also report on the flavors and we will all surely see the difference in my further grows.

My honest, and transparent opinion as always to follow.

Edited August 2, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper

[The_StonedTrooper]

[The_StonedTrooper]

Good article, for interest sake.

https://www.biogrow.co.nz/biochar/biochar-liquid-vinegar/horticultural-uses

Added, @PsyCLownwouldn't this work for the root aphids? 

Edited August 2, 2021 by The_StonedTrooper
Added

[PsyCLown]

11 hours ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Good article, for interest sake.

https://www.biogrow.co.nz/biochar/biochar-liquid-vinegar/horticultural-uses

Added, @PsyCLownwouldn't this work for the root aphids? 

I took a quick look yesterday, not sure whether it would work for root aphids - it says it repels pests, not kills them. Specifically mentions flies and nematodes.

 

What did concern me was the fact that in higher doses it can be used as a herbicide and the fact that it states can control fungal infections - I assume it is a fungicide which can be good but can be bad as well. If someone is using fungi to help keep the roots healthy and happy and to help control pests, this may fuck with that as it may be detrimental to the good fungus as well.

It claims to deodorize, how would this work in combination with the terpenes on the flowers? Perhaps it works by adjusting the PH and therefore deodorizing? Much like how people use white vinegar to help remove odour.

 

I think if we had more in depth info on how it actually works and achieve these claims, that might help us understand it a bit better and what it may work well with and what it should not be used with etc.

It certainly seems to have it's uses, I'd like to try understand it a bit better though before I jump in and start trying it out. I already use a few products which claim a lot of similar things (Increase brix, plant simulant, better root development etc. etc.) and I do use various fungi with my grows.

 

 

Would be keen for you to give it a try and provide us with some feedback as to how well it worked for you and how it compares to some other products as well... Comparing to other products can be a mission and tricky though.

[Thrive]

@PsyCLown these are great insights regarding wood vinegar. Perhaps we should put up a separate post on wood vinegar so as not to go too off-topic here...

Meanwhile, it is very important that one:

- only uses bamboo / reed or oak when making wood vinegar

- distills the wood vinegar properly

Raw wood vinegar will separate out into 3 layers. The bottom layer generally has most of the wood tar, which we use as a wood preservative and to seal wood. The Vikings sealed their boats with pine tar made in the same way. The top layer contains any terpenes which may be carried in the wood. This is why bamboo and/or oak are preferred. Pine contains pinene, which is not great for other plants, even though pinene is also a cannabis terpene. We only collect and sell the pure, distilled middle layer.

We have had quite good success with using wood vinegar on a range of plants, including cannabis. However, I am grateful that someone as dedicated as @The_StonedTrooper is also testing it thoroughly now.   

Edited August 5, 2021 by Thrive

[Marzcanna]

Im also keen to see a report on this @The_StonedTroopermaybe create a new thread with your findings on the product?

[The_StonedTrooper]

I will most certainly do a findings thread, for the Wood Vinegar. 

The flower room will be getting this spray only, and will see what unfolds. 

For the root aphids, yes you might hamper the growth or life of the fungal bacteria in the soil, although we cant be sure how much, and as this is also a soil conditioner, it cant be all that damaging. You'd have to decide I guess, what is more important, killing the root aphids, probably some fungi and having a harvest, or the opposite. 

Which is worse?

Would it even help?

My preferred test method will be for foliage spray and not for the soil.

[PsyCLown]

1 hour ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

I will most certainly do a findings thread, for the Wood Vinegar. 

The flower room will be getting this spray only, and will see what unfolds. 

For the root aphids, yes you might hamper the growth or life of the fungal bacteria in the soil, although we cant be sure how much, and as this is also a soil conditioner, it cant be all that damaging. You'd have to decide I guess, what is more important, killing the root aphids, probably some fungi and having a harvest, or the opposite. 

Which is worse?

Would it even help?

My preferred test method will be for foliage spray and not for the soil.

Remember I am using a combination of things, including Beauveria Bassiana and Metarhizium to help get rid of the root aphids. Both of these are fungus which work for killing pests as well. The fungus is the pesticide in this case, along with some neem and spinosad which do not affect the fungus.

 

If it was just trichoderma and/or mycorrhizal fungi, then sure. Getting rid of pests would be more important than keeping the fungi alive.

Although, how effective is it at getting rid of pests?

@The_StonedTrooper I think for this findings you may need to go out of your way to get some pests, to test it out on. lol

Thrips, spider mites maybe even some aphids if you can find. No clue where you'd find said pests though.

[CreX]

43 minutes ago, PsyCLown said:

Remember I am using a combination of things, including Beauveria Bassiana and Metarhizium to help get rid of the root aphids. Both of these are fungus which work for killing pests as well. The fungus is the pesticide in this case, along with some neem and spinosad which do not affect the fungus.

 

If it was just trichoderma and/or mycorrhizal fungi, then sure. Getting rid of pests would be more important than keeping the fungi alive.

Although, how effective is it at getting rid of pests?

@The_StonedTrooper I think for this findings you may need to go out of your way to get some pests, to test it out on. lol

Thrips, spider mites maybe even some aphids if you can find. No clue where you'd find said pests though.

my balcony LOL

[The_StonedTrooper]

52 minutes ago, PsyCLown said:

Remember I am using a combination of things, including Beauveria Bassiana and Metarhizium to help get rid of the root aphids. Both of these are fungus which work for killing pests as well. The fungus is the pesticide in this case, along with some neem and spinosad which do not affect the fungus.

 

If it was just trichoderma and/or mycorrhizal fungi, then sure. Getting rid of pests would be more important than keeping the fungi alive.

Although, how effective is it at getting rid of pests?

@The_StonedTrooper I think for this findings you may need to go out of your way to get some pests, to test it out on. lol

Thrips, spider mites maybe even some aphids if you can find. No clue where you'd find said pests though.

Sjoe, a tall order, but will see what I can do.

Thrips, I have on and off, and PM is always a issue in flowering, and wanted a safe tool.

But what I really am looking forward to is, the increase in size and quality or flower, flavor and taste of my harvest. 

All while maintaining a good IPM, and that means you should never get infections. 

Proof will be in the proverbial pudding (Baklava)

Only time I ever got aphids, was when I put my plants pot, on the grass outside and not the pavement, but will be running some outdoor plants this season and see if I can keep them pests at bay.

[PsyCLown]

17 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Sjoe, a tall order, but will see what I can do.

Thrips, I have on and off, and PM is always a issue in flowering, and wanted a safe tool.

But what I really am looking forward to is, the increase in size and quality or flower, flavor and taste of my harvest. 

All while maintaining a good IPM, and that means you should never get infections. 

Proof will be in the proverbial pudding (Baklava)

Only time I ever got aphids, was when I put my plants pot, on the grass outside and not the pavement, but will be running some outdoor plants this season and see if I can keep them pests at bay.

If it works well, it can certainly be appealing.

 

A simple spray to help prevent PM, helps reduce the risk of pests (perhaps get rid of them altogether even) and possibly increase brix, plant health, plant resistance, yield etc.

Typically it's a few different sprays / products to achieve this and not quite as cheap as the vinegar. How will it compare, we shall find out.

Even if it is not 100%, the price and what it is able to do and the simplicity can still be very appealing and growers can then decide to supplement with some other products to if they so desire.

[The_StonedTrooper]

Hey Fam,

Hope you all are well today, peace and blessings to you all.

Many of you may already know, that I am in partnership with a very close and good friend, and are building an Eastern Cape (PE) based craft cannabis company, that for a while, and for now, has been making a organic living soil, that you all have seen me using for a while now, all without and or very little input other that water.

Now for me, it would be easy to run a side by side, and compare and give actual honest and transparent feedback, although I still feel this wouldnt be fair and not at all right in terms of who I am as a person.

I've spoken to @donnob and he has agreed to the following...

I will give him the sample soil of @Thrive and the same size sample soil of mine.

Donate 2 or 3 of the same clones, pheno and size. These will be rooted in my soil, on its second run, in small pots.

It will be up to @donnobto decide if he will run 2 or 3 and purchase another brand of soil, one which the forum could decide on together, probably FF green bag, and he can, when the grow off is done.

Do this side by side?

How do we feel and vote on this family...

[donnob]

11 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Hey Fam,

Hope you all are well today, peace and blessings to you all.

Many of you may already know, that I am in partnership with a very close and good friend, and are building an Eastern Cape (PE) based craft cannabis company, that for a while, and for now, has been making a organic living soil, that you all have seen me using for a while now, all without and or very little input other that water.

Now for me, it would be easy to run a side by side, and compare and give actual honest and transparent feedback, although I still feel this wouldnt be fair and not at all right in terms of who I am as a person.

I've spoken to @donnob and he has agreed to the following...

I will give him the sample soil of @Thrive and the same size sample soil of mine.

Donate 2 or 3 of the same clones, pheno and size. These will be rooted in my soil, on its second run, in small pots.

It will be up to @donnobto decide if he will run 2 or 3 and purchase another brand of soil, one which the forum could decide on together, probably FF green bag, and he can, when the grow off is done.

Do this side by side?

How do we feel and vote on this family...

You know my vote 

I'm ecstatic about doing this and I think it would yield invaluable information. 

 

[ORGANinc.]

48 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Hey Fam,

Hope you all are well today, peace and blessings to you all.

Many of you may already know, that I am in partnership with a very close and good friend, and are building an Eastern Cape (PE) based craft cannabis company, that for a while, and for now, has been making a organic living soil, that you all have seen me using for a while now, all without and or very little input other that water.

Now for me, it would be easy to run a side by side, and compare and give actual honest and transparent feedback, although I still feel this wouldnt be fair and not at all right in terms of who I am as a person.

I've spoken to @donnob and he has agreed to the following...

I will give him the sample soil of @Thrive and the same size sample soil of mine.

Donate 2 or 3 of the same clones, pheno and size. These will be rooted in my soil, on its second run, in small pots.

It will be up to @donnobto decide if he will run 2 or 3 and purchase another brand of soil, one which the forum could decide on together, probably FF green bag, and he can, when the grow off is done.

Do this side by side?

How do we feel and vote on this family...

Seems like an fair way of getting an understanding of soils and their make-ups 

However, if this is done, all Soils should be on PAR to some extent. The FF green bag will require feeding down the line. 

I suggest you use Jamies Soil Orgasoilux, if all bags are going to be running solely on innoculations and water.

[The_StonedTrooper]

2 minutes ago, ORGANinc. said:

Seems like an fair way of getting an understanding of soils and their make-ups 

However, if this is done, all Soils should be on PAR to some extent. The FF green bag will require feeding down the line. 

I suggest you use Jamies Soil Orgasoilux, if all bags are going to be running solely on innoculations and water.

Of course all input are valid and will be considered, 

My personal feeling is, that you going to have all three 3 of them using different variables of feeds of waterings, and will always be that way unfortunately, but willing to debate or understand better?

I dont feel the Thrive soil will take only water and such, and will probably need to be fed sooner, and thought it would be more fair, to run each soil, on their preferred inputs. 

And the forum, as a whole, decided what was given and when, and we could all participate in this, in a virtual way.

Ideas?

[ORGANinc.]

Oh I see what you are saying.

Just some one grow in 3 different soils to the best of their ability and knowledge with the help of everyone and just see how it goes.

Ya that could be cool. Goodluck!