Outdoor Autos in the Winter

[Prom]

13 hours ago, Darclinc said:

I only want to get them on the roof after about 3 weeks when they're a bit stronger. Thoughts? Or should I start with as much sun as possible? And what about at night? Should I consider moving them indoors until they are a bit stronger?

Too cold?

I highly suggest to move them indoors over night. Try not to shake the pot to much when you move them.

 

Yes, the temperature took 15 seeds out as I left em out over night and got just cold for one night. 2 of those 15 survived and never got bigger as 10-15cm. Bonsai weed, tells you that things went really wrong.

[Darclinc]

Hmmmm .. ok thanks.

So just to clarify, take them indoors throughout the entire grow or just while they are still small plants?

[SkunkPharm]

My suggestion would be to wait until August. In the mean while save up and buy a 75w grow light from GrowOpz. You will also need a fan. Then you can grow to your hearts content. June and July is not good for growing outdoors.

[Darclinc]

14 hours ago, Bay Seeds said:

This meter can test the soil runoff water and give you an idea of how much nutrients or total desolved salts are in the soil.

Would one like this be a good option as an all in one to measure both the EC PPM and PH?

https://www.takealot.com/ec-ph-and-temperature-3-in-1-water-meter/PLID73022628

[Darclinc]

21 minutes ago, SkunkPharm said:

My suggestion would be to wait until August. In the mean while save up and buy a 75w grow light from GrowOpz. You will also need a fan. Then you can grow to your hearts content. June and July is not good for growing outdoors.

I hear you, which is why I started this thread in the first place. I live under no illusions about my chances. However, TBH I'm not sure I can wait that long as I'm just extremely excited to get going.

The way I see it, worst case scenario I lose a few hundred bucks in seeds, best case I get something, even if it's small, in return and learn something for the next round. Also, indoors isn't really an option at this point, for various reasons.

[West Coast Vaper]

I highly suggest to move them indoors over night. Try not to shake the pot to much when you move them.
 
Yes, the temperature took 15 seeds out as I left em out over night and got just cold for one night. 2 of those 15 survived and never got bigger as 10-15cm. Bonsai weed, tells you that things went really wrong.

Something similar happened to me.

Sent from my S40 using Tapatalk

[Darclinc]

How old were your plants at the time?

[Bay Seeds]

10 hours ago, Darclinc said:

Would one like this be a good option as an all in one to measure both the EC PPM and PH?

https://www.takealot.com/ec-ph-and-temperature-3-in-1-water-meter/PLID73022628

You dont need a ph pen, i hardly ever use the bluelab pen. I regret buying it. SA municipal water is usally a bit alkaline. A small fishtank airpump with a airstone bubbling away in your reservoir will bring it close to 6.5 

[The_StonedTrooper]

10 hours ago, Bay Seeds said:

You dont need a ph pen, i hardly ever use the bluelab pen. I regret buying it. SA municipal water is usally a bit alkaline. A small fishtank airpump with a airstone bubbling away in your reservoir will bring it close to 6.5 

You could be like me too, never check it, ever...

Many grows later, I found out recently that the Calsap product I'm using in my new grow, lifts the pH past 8.5 sometimes and the first time feeding that, was a huge shock to the plants.

I now always pH, regardless. 

Ps, your Stormtrooper seeds are hunted, and have a female that grows fast like a male and the stem rub, yummy.

[Darclinc]

Hmmm .. I've already bought PH up and down, so I think I'm going to do the PH thing regardless.

Everywhere I've read makes a pretty big deal about PH and how it can potentially stop your plants from taking up nutrients if it isn't controlled to within a certain range. Again, doesn't seem like a massive mission to do, so I'm probably going to do it.

10 hours ago, Bay Seeds said:

A small fishtank airpump with a airstone bubbling away in your reservoir will bring it close to 6.5

Seems like that will be more expensive than getting a pen?

[Bay Seeds]

5 hours ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

You could be like me too, never check it, ever...

Many grows later, I found out recently that the Calsap product I'm using in my new grow, lifts the pH past 8.5 sometimes and the first time feeding that, was a huge shock to the plants.

I now always pH, regardless. 

Ps, your Stormtrooper seeds are hunted, and have a female that grows fast like a male and the stem rub, yummy.

Yeah when it comes to troubleshooting issues a ph pen is ideal, i just regret how little my pen gets used versus what it cost. Please send updates on that female cj. 

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

yeah, I got the bluelabs toolbox long long ago finished the grow I was busy with at the time then moved over to organics most people will say that's stupid  for a while I was bitter with having made the purchase, cause it wasn't cheap and hearing the majority of organic growers aks me why I would even need to test for PH or PPM, cause it's organic... right...? only to realise later on that they just showed me their level of understanding of the whole thing without thinking it through all the way, or they just haven't been doing it long enough to encounter all that can to wrong, in which case I am glad for them, but not everyone gets that lucky. Clearly there are going to be situations where even organic growers wana take the guessing out the game and test for both PH and PPM. 

it's just safer to have access to these tools.

I have to advise against buying any kinda tech equipment and stuff that can "do everything in one" and rather go with tech equipment that's one thing made to do or test one specific thing. this will ensure better accuracy. This is just my  but tech things that can do it all tend to be more gimmick-like and don't stand the test of time. In the long run it's cheaper to buy more expensive stuff

[Prom]

2 hours ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

yeah, I got the bluelabs toolbox long long ago finished the grow I was busy with at the time then moved over to organics most people will say that's stupid  for a while I was bitter with having made the purchase, cause it wasn't cheap and hearing the majority of organic growers aks me why I would even need to test for PH or PPM, cause it's organic... right...? only to realise later on that they just showed me their level of understanding of the whole thing without thinking it through all the way, or they just haven't been doing it long enough to encounter all that can to wrong, in which case I am glad for them, but not everyone gets that lucky. Clearly there are going to be situations where even organic growers wana take the guessing out the game and test for both PH and PPM. 

it's just safer to have access to these tools.

I have to advise against buying any kinda tech equipment and stuff that can "do everything in one" and rather go with tech equipment that's one thing made to do or test one specific thing. this will ensure better accuracy. This is just my  but tech things that can do it all tend to be more gimmick-like and don't stand the test of time. In the long run it's cheaper to buy more expensive stuff

Just because it is organic, doesn't mean you can mix together what you want. Or lets say, once you add a chemical compound, you will very likely run into issues.

There is no TopMax right now... very annoying. I got me some silica product to help while i wait for TopMax to be back on the shelves. Those 3ml per 10 liter already pushed 2 plants into a lockout, 2 different strains. You see, you flush and things are back to normal. Not even unpacked my Pen.. i think the thingy is broken anyhow  never used. Last time I dipped it into calibration solution it just showed me crap.

If you run hydro, pen or fix installed Ph meter is a must.. your only option to mix things right. That is why those pens are around in my opinion. (Sorry, I ignore the coco dudes as usual ^^ is just half/half)

If you grow, you need to know the plants lockout signs, which you learn by time. And as soon as you see a plant going stall, you flush it.. always the same remedy ^^ Get as much water out of the pot as you can and put her back. Week later she should be green on all new growth and go back to fertilizing. I wanted to get the solution tested with the silica in, very curious how much is goes off with those 6ml in 20 liters. Will just borrow a pen for a quick use ^^ Would prefer to have TopMax back  and go back to normal.

Edited June 4, 2022 by Prom

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

the idea that people say don't test ppm or ph when you grow organic is redundant. 

why would you "watch" and what would you "watch" for? you'll be looking for signs of things not being right. signs of stress in form of too much or too little PPM, right? or signs of stress from PH being out of whack..... sooooooo why would I wait to see signs on the plant if I can just test with a device that gives me the correct information with just a press of a button? and fix the problem before seeing the signs and before the plant has stressed at all? 

5 hours ago, Prom said:

If you grow, you need to know the plants lockout signs, which you learn by time. 

if you have a good, accurate device it will help you not waste so much time and school fees. 

first problem you run into you test and from there you golden. no guessing games. cause let's be honest, the sole fact that you said "which you learn by time" means you know no one will know the signs on day one. if you have a device you will.  

[SkunkPharm]

The last time I used my pH pen was to check the pH of my pool. And that was well over a year ago. And before that it hard to remember.

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

@SkunkPharm  that's pretty cool

hope you don't run into the same issue as StonedTrooper in the future!

when talking organics, ph it's much less of an issue than ppm, though both can still swing. 

if you keep using water with a ph of 1 or 10 (something way out) it's unlikely that any soil will maintain ph neutrality over long period of time. especially if you reusing soil. tap water here where I am comes out at 9 sometimes 10 and I have seen my living soil climb till about 8 ph and the plants did not like that. could've avoided it.

it's a good thing that you have a couple years of growing behind you. good to know the products you use and what product does what and all that stuff.... but the best of all is having the probes on hand, because not everyone has years of growing behind them and they don't know all the science on day one and having the probes makes it much easier to understand than just "taking someones word for it".

when studying this at universities the professor will give you probes to get accurate readings for the main purpose of "not having to take someones word for it" and to not play guessing games. hyrdo / organic. there's no harm in wanting to get the stuff right from day one instead of stressing a bunch of plants just to learn from that anyway. if a professor points to a plant and sais "that's what's going on in there, just take my word for it", I wouldn't go to that class anymore. 

I've seen quite a few cases on the forum similar to my learning experience where probes would've saved these peoples grows in a jiff. 

once they know what all the signs look like with no second guessing they can use the probes for their pools too! great device to have!

[SkunkPharm]

1 hour ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

@SkunkPharm  that's pretty cool

hope you don't run into the same issue as StonedTrooper in the future!

when talking organics, ph it's much less of an issue than ppm, though both can still swing. 

if you keep using water with a ph of 1 or 10 (something way out) it's unlikely that any soil will maintain ph neutrality over long period of time. especially if you reusing soil. tap water here where I am comes out at 9 sometimes 10 and I have seen my living soil climb till about 8 ph and the plants did not like that. could've avoided it.

it's a good thing that you have a couple years of growing behind you. good to know the products you use and what product does what and all that stuff.... but the best of all is having the probes on hand, because not everyone has years of growing behind them and they don't know all the science on day one and having the probes makes it much easier to understand than just "taking someones word for it".

when studying this at universities the professor will give you probes to get accurate readings for the main purpose of "not having to take someones word for it" and to not play guessing games. hyrdo / organic. there's no harm in wanting to get the stuff right from day one instead of stressing a bunch of plants just to learn from that anyway. if a professor points to a plant and sais "that's what's going on in there, just take my word for it", I wouldn't go to that class anymore. 

I've seen quite a few cases on the forum similar to my learning experience where probes would've saved these peoples grows in a jiff. 

once they know what all the signs look like with no second guessing they can use the probes for their pools too! great device to have!

I under stand were you are coming from. I only use rain water. Reuse my soil. Never had any issues. 

[Prom]

15 hours ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

if you have a good, accurate device it will help you not waste so much time and school fees. 

If you always mix the same amounts together, the result in Ph should be the same, if the producer of the stuff does his job right. So you would need a pen once... till you change again your fertilizer setup.

I go with @SkunkPharm... Even i ran into issues with 2 plants out of 94, I do not Ph... those 2 could also just have a genetic defect not be able to handle nutrition transport like the others.. or Ph was off for those 2 pots as I mixed something in while repotting.. or a concentration of substance inside the bag i used for those pots was off (different spots, so not sequence pots, is unlikely). My 2 lockouts didn't teach me a thing... i can just guess why those 2 needed a flush and the rest didn't. Both plants are back to green and get the same mix as the rest.. nothing wrong with them so far. If all plants went lockout.. yes, I would have to dig into the why and what I did wrong.. but 2 out of 94... I just flushed each and didn't really care why. You don't always get answers.. but you can always rescue each plant with a simple remedy.

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

well, there you go guys, to all the new growers, you don't need to buy probes, just let your plants stress then play guessing games and hope for the best  

personally I want to help others, not make them feel helpless cause they can't guess the right stuff. 

if you know for yourself it took time for you to learn how to spot these things, why not just cut the loss of time off by using tools? 

I'll respectfully stop giving advice as I can see there is no point. everyone should just have years of experience from day one. that makes more sense doesn't it. 

 

have a lekker sunday

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

44 minutes ago, SkunkPharm said:

I under stand were you are coming from. I only use rain water. Reuse my soil. Never had any issues. 

This is the thing, when using rain water it's something specific to your situation. the vast majority of growers, especially new growers, get their water from the tap. with a small amount of those people using 3phase filters, if that. some people bubble their tap water. still not the same as rain water. If you wana make a point of how things work for you, you have to state the things that you do, that can literally flip the whole show on it's head. 

anyhow, have a blessed sunday!

 

 

 

[Ill_Evan]

I pH test everything 

[Prom]

1 hour ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

This is the thing, when using rain water it's something specific to your situation. the vast majority of growers, especially new growers, get their water from the tap. with a small amount of those people using 3phase filters, if that. some people bubble their tap water. still not the same as rain water. If you wana make a point of how things work for you, you have to state the things that you do, that can literally flip the whole show on it's head. 

anyhow, have a blessed sunday!

Don't mix apples and Kiwis ^^ As soon as you use tap water, you run a chemical setup.. they do not drop organics into the water to fluorite it  Tap water is chemical feeding and needs to get Ph'ed. You only can skip it on rain water. Never flush soil with tap water.. the chemistry inside the water is mend to kill micro organisms.. not helping your soil to drench it with a weak disinfectant. 

If you want all the tools needed to run your plants in the right regions.. you need a few tools, not just a pen.. and if you don't get all needed tools, you never get the full answers anyhow. The pen helps you with EC, PPM and Ph.. that give you an idea what you feed.. but not if it is the right stuff you feed. Next you would need a refractometer for your brix numbers to see if you have the right amount sugar in your leaves.. and when you have the right sugar in your leaves, you need a quantum flux meter to give them the right amount of light.. and when all that is in the right region.. you have a very good run. What you feed them.. is a bit key.

Does a new grower need all those tools? I wouldn't say no.. but also not yes. Is a question how serious you want to tackle the topic of growing weed. The more professional you want to go, the more tools you need to confirm your learning process. Once you have all in, you don't need those tools anymore. I use the Quantum Flux meter only when I get new lights in to measure and learn the light. I do not use the tool on my old lights.. I know how to hang those for each stage.. and is not that 950 micromole or 1000 do a huge difference. The tools give you a range to run in. 

So if you Ph every time.. you do nothing wrong.. and if you work with tap water.. you should check, wouldn't do it every day, if I always use the same amounts to mix a batch. If you poor in by hand.. Christ, yes, measure. If you use syringes and measure in ml on 10+ liters of water.. you should end with the same result every time, as long as the guy in the water storage did his job right too. Chemistry is an exact science.

My final advice would be this. If you have rain water storage go soil with organic fertilizers. If you only have tap water available, coco or hydro. If you want to go soil with tap water.. you need to Ph, at least even i would. Chemical feeding is just different. In my case I would go hydro with tap water, what i ran in Europe. If you want to grow big.. hydro is the only way to simplify your feeding to max on big scale (10k plants and more). 

And is my opinion.. what means it counts mainly for me ^^ others have other opinions. I changed from hydro to soil as i had rain water available suddenly.. and somebody with a lot more experience as i have told me to try it. I enjoy the peaceful growing with soil. Use my gadgets not as often as before.. except the refractometer, the leaves still baffle me a bit what color they have compared to sugar content. Strains behave very different. So after 35 years of growing weed... not even close of understanding the plant in full. 

So please, don't stop giving advice.. i might be the one asking at one stage 

Edited June 5, 2022 by Prom

[Naughty.Psychonaut]

basically to sum it all up

sq1 -> having probes = safe 

sq 2 -> not having probes = less safe

sq3 -> knowing someone with a probe that can help at a moments notice so you don't have to spend the money to get probes = a little safer but less reliable. 

once you got the visual keys it's still easy to misdiagnose, throwing you back at sq1.

[Darclinc]

On 6/5/2022 at 7:05 AM, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

but the best of all is having the probes on hand, because not everyone has years of growing behind them and they don't know all the science on day one and having the probes makes it much easier to understand than just "taking someones word for it".

Exactly. The way I see it, I have no experience of any kind, so in order to give my plants the best chances it makes sense to me to start with a good PH as opposed to being reactive and trying to remedy problems I don't know how to remedy or probably even identify, i.e. not understanding the signs before it's potentially too late. I'm reading up on what I can, and have decided I'd rather be proactive than reactive. I know it's not that simple, but it makes most sense to me as a novice grower.

Worst case scenario I have a shiny new PH pen to also test my 90k liter pool water, yaaaay!

D

[Darclinc]

On 6/5/2022 at 9:06 AM, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

the vast majority of growers, especially new growers, get their water from the tap. with a small amount of those people using 3phase filters, if that. some people bubble their tap water.

Based on my limited knowledge I''ve decided I'm going to most likely do the following:

Get my water from the tap, filter it through the Brita's carbon filter (which we do daily anyway so I'll just get from there and leave it outside for a bit), and PH correct it to around 6.2 (if necessary) before giving it to the plants. 

Edited June 7, 2022 by Darclinc